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Lamuel D.W. Biambo
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This is a great thread
May 26, 2004 - 04:25 AM
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To put the world right in order, we must first put the nation in order; to put the nation in order, we must first put the family in order; to put the family in order, we must first cultivate our personal life; we must first set our hearts right!
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farhana siddique
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MARVELLOUS degini2
May 27, 2004 - 10:21 AM
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Originally posted by degini2
To put the world right in order, we must first put the nation in order; to put the nation in order, we must first put the family in order; to put the family in order, we must first cultivate our personal life; we must first set our hearts right!
Just wanna say, I agree 2 the core with all u analyzed.
Undoubtedly, the process of purification must be started 4rom within ourselves. Then gradually it should encompass the institution of family, nation and consequently the whole globe.
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iman sadiqyar
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Re: This is a great thread
August 12, 2004 - 08:23 AM
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Dear digini and fari
i agree with both of you and we can make the world a better place to live in.
And this opportunity is brought to us by the TIG comunity.
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Ray Ovac
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How to achieve World Peace
August 12, 2004 - 08:39 AM
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Originally posted by degini2
To put the world right in order, we must first put the nation in order; to put the nation in order, we must first put the family in order; to put the family in order, we must first cultivate our personal life; we must first set our hearts right!
I could not agree more with this. The other thing, I think, is to enhance communication between peoples of different cultures and nations. When we understand each other, we are far less likely to want to commit violence.
When one's enemy is "faceless", it is easier to bring them harm...but when we know each other, talk with each other, see the faces and dreams and wishes of each other, the thought of ever taking up arms is almost unimaginable.
Is for precisely this reason that I think that places such as TIG can be so important. Imagine if just 1% of all of the people in the world between the ages of 15 and 35 contributed here on a weekly basis....what kind of impact might that have? How hard would it become for any government or media source to convince citizens that the people of another culture or nation is worthy of being killed when tens of thousands of people have actually met and talked with their "enemy"?
It starts with each of us, but it can be done with *all* of us!
God Bless
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Phillip
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This is a great thread
August 12, 2004 - 09:40 AM
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The emphasis on personal investment is excellent and I agree with Rayovac's questioning ... "if just 1% of all of the people in the world between the ages of 15 and 35 contributed here on a weekly basis....what kind of impact might that have?" These two facets of this thread reflect, I think, the value of two things that I often think about: 1)Introspection to challenge ourselves to grow in a way that will encourage us to live our lives in such a way that we leave the world a little better than we found it ... or at least create that potential. 2) The way we allocate our resources as individuals and nations.
The second issue is of partricular interest to me. I believe, for example, that the U.S. had little choice about going into Afghanistan after 9/11. But is the same true of Iraq?
It seems to me that how we decide to conduct foreign policy can be traced back to the core issue of getting our hearts in order ... the issue of personal perspectives. If enough of us can address that issue then national perspectives can be changed and that could truly impact the way we conduct foreign policy in constructive ways.
Here's what I mean ... right now foreign policy is conducted primarily by national diplomatic agencies and militaries. Diplomats represent the interest of governments and frequently compromise the interests of populations. That's why good nations like the U.S. end up supporting bad people like Manuel Noriega, etc. ... the intentions are good and it may seem that the interests of governments are being served at the time ... but many innocent people end up suffering under people like that and the national credibility of (in this case the U.S.) suffers as well. And then there's the military. The military seems to be a necessity in the world at this time. I wouldn't argue otherwise. But to a man with only a hammer every problem looks like a nail.
So I think you guys are right. Can you imagine if the perspectives of a significant percentage of the people who live in the most powerful nations could be altered as you suggest here? Maybe instead of seeing so many enemies we'd begin to see more opportunities ... opportunities to improve the lives of people all over the world.
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Ashraf
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Re: This is a great thread
August 14, 2004 - 05:10 AM
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degini2,
Well said !
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Ashraf
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Re: This is a great thread
August 14, 2004 - 05:28 AM
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pwagner,
Most Arabs and Muslims have real problems with the American foreign policy and it realy saddens me that it is getting worse rather than getting better as years pass by. You have from one side a strange policy that is almost blind of the suffering of the Palestinians at the hands of the IDF and Sharon's war criminal behaviours, and another which holds Arabs - and even their religion - accountable for almost anything. We did not see the American foreign policy condemning the complete destruction of Jenin refugee camp, or even the almost daily demolition of Palestinian families houses in Khan Yunis and Rafah. The lack of trust, and the increasingly vicious hatred is a direct result of the injustices done by such foreign policy.
I was taught in the US that America is the land where people are respected regardless of what religion they believe in, or what ethnicity they belong to..but I have sadly realized that this is true when we are talking about the US dealing with its own citizens but not necessarily with ones living outside its borders.
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Phillip
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Re: This is a great thread
August 14, 2004 - 06:10 AM
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Palestinian,
Is there something in my post that leads you to believe I am generally happy with the way American foreign policy is conducted? If there is I am not aware of it and you should have the courtesy to point it out.
My remarks were not intended to defend any "side" ... Israel's, the PLOs or anyone elses. I think American foreign policy needs to be redirected. and I think I made that clear. I might add that I feel equally frustrated by Israel and the PLO and equally sympathetic with the idea that both Jews and Palestinians need to have a home, dignity, security and social justice.
I've been criticizing Sharon since his incursion into Lebanon so many years ago and also Arafat. Even others within the PLO movement have become disgusted with his corruption. Jews and Arabs lived in relative peace before foreign powers became involved. Europeans were looking for a dumping ground for the Jews who, after all, had historical ties to Palestine. And the Arab nations surrounding Israel fomented much of the hatred that created the now long-standing rift between Jews and Palestinians that has become so violent and tragic. Please don't try to influence me with your frustrations without - in a civil and polite way - acknowledging the full breadth of responsibility.
Jordan crushed and expelled Palestinian refugees rather than looking for some way to work with it's neighbor Israel to assure their future. If Egypt and Syria had spent a small fraction of the monies they've invested trying to exterminate Israel militarily on Palestinian developmnent projects life among the Palestinians would have to be much better than what it is today. American media is horribly biased toward Israel, but Arab media is as horribly biased against Israel or moreso.
I disagree that the world is not aware of the suffering of the Palestinians. I authored a front-page newspaper article from the Palestinian perspective in 1994 ... a decade ago. That's not new news, is it? I admire your passion Palestinian ... but you risk alienating people who are sympathetic to your cause. You see deamons everywhere and I am not one of them.
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Ashraf
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Re: This is a great thread
August 15, 2004 - 03:04 AM
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pwagner,
>>Is there something in my post that leads you to believe I am generally happy with the way American foreign policy is conducted? If there is I am not aware of it and you should have the courtesy to point it out.
No. That is not what I intended from my post. I simply listed some of the reasons why there is so much disgust regarding the US foreign policy in the Middle East.
>>My remarks were not intended to defend any "side" ... Israel's, the PLOs or anyone elses.
I could see that from your post
>>I think American foreign policy needs to be redirected. and I think I made that clear. I might add that I feel equally frustrated by Israel and the PLO and equally sympathetic with the idea that both Jews and Palestinians need to have a home, dignity, security and social justice.
I respect that opinion. However I disgree that someone should have a home at the expense of someone else living there before.
>>I've been criticizing Sharon since his incursion into Lebanon so many years ago and also Arafat. Even others within the PLO movement have become disgusted with his corruption. Jews and Arabs lived in relative peace before foreign powers became involved.
That is an accurate reading of what realy happened. Let me just stress that the problem we Muslims and Arabs have is with the zionists but necessarily with all Jews.
>>Europeans were looking for a dumping ground for the Jews who, after all, had historical ties to Palestine. And the Arab nations surrounding Israel fomented much of the hatred that created the now long-standing rift between Jews and Palestinians that has become so violent and tragic. Please don't try to influence me with your frustrations without - in a civil and polite way - acknowledging the full breadth of responsibility.
The Arab-Israeli conflict did not come into existence until the Zionists met in Switzerland in 1897 and decided to establish a Jewish homeland in Palestine. The zionist movement tried even to purchase Palestine from the Ottoman sultan (Abdul-Hameed The Second) but he refused since as he said that Palestine was not owned by him but by all Muslims. The migration started in 1917 after Belfour promised the Jews to establish that homeland for the Jews. Since then, the real atrocities started and Jews began forcing the Palestinians out of their villages with help of the British mandate and the zionist Hagana and Stern gangs which were armed and well-trained. The Arab involvement in the crisis was a normal consequence of such events. I am not influencing you with anything. I am sorry if you had this impression. I am just stating the events as they occured.
>>Jordan crushed and expelled Palestinian refugees rather than looking for some way to work with it's neighbor Israel to assure their future. If Egypt and Syria had spent a small fraction of the monies they've invested trying to exterminate Israel militarily on Palestinian developmnent projects life among the Palestinians would have to be much better than what it is today. American media is horribly biased toward Israel, but Arab media is as horribly biased against Israel or moreso.
I think it is very unfair to blame the Jordanians or Egyptians for the Palestinian refugee crisis. They were not the ones after all who expelled them from their homes in Palestine. Their problem is mainly with dealing with the refugees after the expel had already occured. In other words, they should have dealt more fairly and humanely with the refugees who were expelled by the Israelis.
The Arab media is biased against "Israel" because of what they see every day from the Israelis in the current intifada - confiscation of lands, random killing of women and children, demolition of houses in Rafah, Khan Yunis, Gaza, Nablus, Ramallah - and because of the daily suffering and humilation the IDF enjoys inflicting on Palestinian families especially at refugee camps and security check points. Just very recently, over 3000 Palestinians were held between the border of Egypt and Gaza Strip at Rafah pass entry for weeks after the Israelis refused to let them in. How could anyone be not biased against such actions??
>>I disagree that the world is not aware of the suffering of the Palestinians. I authored a front-page newspaper article from the Palestinian perspective in 1994 ... a decade ago. That's not new news, is it? I admire your passion Palestinian ... but you risk alienating people who are sympathetic to your cause. You see deamons everywhere and I am not one of them.
Yes there is awareness of the suffering of the Palestinians around the world but I was talking specifically about the American foreign policy which help increase that suffering..and sorry I do not see you as a 'deamon'.
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