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S
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War ... is it right?
September 29, 2003 - 03:02 AM
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It is just not right to me. Anyway people of a country would never want to involve themselves in wars.War is just Childish behaviour that those politician up there put up.Should everyone dispose of weapons?Should people really listen to president if <s>he has decided to go on a war?Should war be extinct and any disagreement should be solved without resorting to any form of violence?
What's your say?
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S
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take note
September 29, 2003 - 03:06 AM
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pls ignore the the line that dashed across my words above.
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Haseeb
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notoviolence
September 29, 2003 - 05:07 AM
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The great Gandhi said" I object to violence,because when it seems to do good, the good is temproray and the evil it does is for always".
So lets stick to this and lets say ,notoviolence,and above all notoviolence for Peace ,as it is being painted today ( I mean) they rage violence and say they are doing it for peace and democrocy .
You Kill, You destroy and You say you are doing it for Peace!!!!!!
Its really kiddish.
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S
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Re: War ... is it right?
September 29, 2003 - 10:11 AM
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yeah and in some ways you can see that it is pretty hippocritical
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Luke Lieberman
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 6, 2003 - 10:37 AM
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I don't know anyone who will say "war is good" the question is - is it neccissary?
The Nazis were intent on wiping out entire cultures - they were invading their neighbors in almost unheard of acts of hostility.
The jews tried "non-violent' resistence -it didn't work.
So - if a Nazi came to kill your family - would you fight? I would. And if they came to invade my country - I would fight them.
"I felt that while war could never be a positive or absolute good, it could serve as a negative good in the sense of preventing the spread or growth of an evil force. War, as horrible as it is, might be preferable to surrender to a totalitarian system - Nazi, Facist, or Communist" - Martin Luther King Jr.
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Matt Wolpert
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 6, 2003 - 11:03 AM
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The simple fact is that violence is an inherent, necessary part of nature. Most organisms on this planet kill other living things to survive, and that is the tradition that war springs from.
The biggest problem with world peace is that EVERYONE in the world has to agree on it, or else that one guy who says, "Yeah, I'm not really into the whole peace thing" is holding all the cards. It's hard enough to get four people to agree on where to eat dinner.
Sure, war is bad, and so is hunger, and so is suffering in any shape, but trying to erraticate something that will always be is an exercise in futility. We must simply try to mitigate the suffering in the world to the best of our ability.
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Sarah
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 11, 2003 - 09:54 AM
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The politicians of the world play a game of chess, except the chessmen are alive and breathing. 'Sacrifices' are made for the ultimate goal; checkmate and victory. Or, when they run out of pieces, a stalemate, with blood all over the board.
question: how many plastic chessmen were left on the board at the end of the last chess game you played?
Go Figure
Sudden thought: Isn't 'White Knight' a codename in one of the James Bond films? *sigh*
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Haseeb
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 14, 2003 - 04:55 AM
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Originally posted by luke
The Nazis were intent on wiping out entire cultures - they were invading their neighbors in almost unheard of acts of hostility.
The current Imperialists on a mission not that different to what the Nazis were on. Just Imagine what would the face of this earth be if a force against them starts to ressist and fight them violently?
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Oke Rotimi
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 15, 2003 - 11:32 AM
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There will be no progress or any reasonable development where there is war.
War is horrible and i believe there is no right thinking person that will resolve to war in solving a dispute or any issue.
Oke Rotimi (omo iya shade)
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Luke Lieberman
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 16, 2003 - 02:27 AM
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The American war in Afghanistan is not comperable to the Holocaust.
Not in any way. It is a war - yes - but
Millions of Afghani's are not being herded into concentration camps and gassed, burned, starved and shot. Perhapes you might study what the Nazis actually did before you start comparing it to the US war in Afghanistan.
Why do you think the US is there - to plunder your fabulous wealth? To steal your riches? (As the Nazi's did)
No - perhapes that is the reason for the war in Iraq - perhapes - But there is NO PROFIT to be had in Kabul.
The US gives money to Afghanistan - not take. If you think we are there for any other reason then a response to the 9-11 attacks you are wrong. It is costing us American lives and American money - AND THERE IS NO ADVANTAGE
The only reason the US is spending sooo much in such a destitute country is because of terrorism - because Al-Qada destroyed downtown Manhatten.
Before Sept 11 2001 - NO ONE in my country was thinking to fight in Afghanistan.
I was in New York when terrorism hit - I had friends who died - I saw it with my bare eye.
At that moment I wanted to find the people responsible for this crime and destroy them - destroy the terrorist organization so that they could never kill innocents again.
what ele was 9-11 besides terrorism? Was there any other point? Any other goal?
- Americans are not Nazis, we do not want to kill all Moslems. We do not want to rob you. We are not making any money off of you - instead it is costing us a fortune - take it from me - I pay taxes.
America is a democracy - Nazi Germany was a facist dictatorship. They are opposites.
I would much prefer that Afghanistan had cleaned its own house. I sincerely hope the young people of Iran rise and take hold of their own destiny. That they overthrow the fundamentalist leadership and join the 21st century.
It is long overdue - democracy is power in the hands of the people. We are not imperialist - because we do not want to rule you - we want you to rule yourselves.
And if Bush tries to rule you - if he refuses to give you democracy - then we will excersize our power of democracy and take from him the mantle of leadership. We will elect a new leader.
But you must take it in your own hands - democracy is not some gift we can hand you - all we can do is make it possible - you must find it for yourselves.
And a final word to the wise - if you want to fight the US military - you do so at your own peril.
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Dying
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 18, 2003 - 01:44 AM
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I think people need to just get over trying to decide whether war is good or bad. We have always had wars, and we always will. It is part of human nature, and gets right back to darwin's theory of survival of the fittest.
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Haseeb
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 24, 2003 - 04:38 AM
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Luke, I never meant to compare the war in Afghanistan to the Holocaust , it can never be campared and a dam folish would do soo.
The fact is that I compared violence to violence ,and yet stand firm on my point that violence will never do good , even if used as an act of revange in reply to the violence raged on you, TOW BAD CAN NEVER GOOD.
You Got A wronge meaning out of my words ,I never tried to justify what the Nazis did. nor I have to and why should i? But whats is common is that they had a mind set and plan, they went on that plan , used violence to implement their poor plan.
Now, same has the US it has a very much just plan and agenda of spreading Peace and Democracy, but dont you think that the way its being done is not helping the two causes?
You dont know what the feeling in this part of the world is , I am social democrat when it comes to thinking, I know what peace and democracy is , but MAn , millions here belive that bombing and aggression is peace and democracy, because thats what the US is doing , its bombing and saying its for peace and democracy.
I yet againg say that i think i have never doubted the goodwill of US for Afghanistan , and that it wants to help.
But even then , this statment is not just "But there is NO PROFIT to be had in Kabul" , think on it from another point of view ? Have a look at this point as a citizen of this world ,not a mere American .
And I am some how sure that you would get to a different conclusion.
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Haseeb
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 24, 2003 - 04:42 AM
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Originally posted by luke
And a final word to the wise - if you want to fight the US military - you do so at your own peril.
A very good statment to hear from Rumsfeld, not that good to hear from a civillian and younge citizen of this world.
Aqain, why should one fight?
Why not negotiate any difference , if they exist!
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Luke Lieberman
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 24, 2003 - 12:46 PM
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allright - you got my feathers up when there is comparison between us and nazis - it just doesn't seem fair.
I like what you said about about people equating "justice and democracy" with bombs falling because I am sure it is accurate.
That is a very good example of how this administraition uses double speak ie "fight for peace" - there is an implicit contradiction there.
Here is ultimately the problem - I am not a big beleiver in the virtue of war - but sometimes it is the only option. How else could we possibly deal with Al Qeada and the Taliban?
The point I was making about the Nazis is that war was the only option left to the allies - we had to fight violently against the Nazis.
When the other sides stated goal is your destruction it makes negotiation impossible - Al Qeada was training and arming and intending to strike us again - nonviolent protest just does not seem like a very effective alternative in this instance.
My problem with what my government has done is that in its zeal to attack Iraq it has forgotten that we still have a job to do in Afghanistan. We have just moved on - meanwhile Taliban and Al Qeada forces in Pakistan are organizing and jumping the boarder at will.
We have pulled out many of our rescources in order to use them in Iraq - and at the end of the day the price is paid by the Afghani people.
This is not right - and I am not happy that Bush decided to attack Iraq. First thing is first - take care of Afghanistan. The way we are leaving it it will just fall back into anarchy.
The Taliban are being interviewed by press now - its a joke.
Anyway - my warning about our army came from an implication in your words that anti-us forces would engage us violently - and to that I say - you do so at your own peril.
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Luke Lieberman
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Re: War ... is it right?
October 25, 2003 - 02:50 AM
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What happened to them was a great reduction in their capabilities - we took them effectively down to zero.
But it is like gardening - you can't simply cut a weed because it will just grow back - you have to grip it by the roots and tear it from the earth.
It is sort of amazing the way the entire world - not just the US - is ignoring the problems in Afghanistan.
I do think that if the Taliban starts gaining alot of momentum you will see US forces back in there.
The US has too much at stake to allow the Taliban to retake your country - we'll just hit them again.
Of course this is no real solution as the resilience of Al Qeada can be plainly seen. The confrontation with Al Qeada must be comprehensive and complete.
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