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Lucia
连接： Jan 14, 2004
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Re: sex before marriage
February 21, 2005 - 08:21 AM
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Originally posted by luke
You know what the real kicker is wallflower - while you sit there in your repressed celibacy trying to attract a mate - I could steal your woman right out from under you because I know what I'm doing - I know how to please a woman - and you don't - I have the comfort and confidence in dealing with women that comes from sexual experience.
I'm afraid I didn't have the time or patience at the moment to read all of the posts from the beginning, so I apologize if I repeat something that has already been said.
I have to say that discussions like this are not productive, because each side has a different set of values and different priorities in a relationship, and possibly a different kind of internal make-up.
To respond to this remark made by Luke to Wallflower, as a woman, I have to say that there is no way in hell that Luke could "steal" me, or any woman with my values, from someone like Wallflower (a statement which is offensive and arrogant in and of itself). The reason is because I don't share Luke's values, nor do the girls he can "take" share my values or the values of a man who refuses to engage in premarital sex.
I have learned through a lot of bad experiences, that for the sake of keeping peace in your life, or in my life as it were, you need to find people who share your own values and then you will be happy. When the fundamental values of two individuals are diametrically opposed to one another, you have two people just fighting with no hope or desire to meet eye to eye - which they should not do anyway if they stand firm by their values.
I may think one way is good and the other way is bad (morally/spiritually), but this is essentially a separate issue from the question of differing values and it is an issue I don't like to discuss, because, as I mentioned above, it only generates an unconstructive argument and hostility, which Luke demonstrates well in the beginning of this thread.
Thus, the decision to save sex for marriage is a decision that is made by the individual according to his own values and desires and each side has reasons which support his values and inner desires. That makes the question of whether you "should" wait or not subjective.
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Saladin
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Re: sex before marriage
February 21, 2005 - 09:00 AM
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Yes Bitsy, I agree with what you said about the individual nature of choosing one's mate.
The question about the need to have sex eather before or after marriage is a strictly individual question; everyone is responsible for his/her own values and morals, as long as the society is protected from phenomena like HIV/AIDS, abortion of embryos, children not knowing whom their father is (in many parts of the world this question really matters)...no one is gonna go and check for everyone making sex before or after marriage; it's a completely personal issue between the man and woman engaged in the relationship.
Hence, Bitsy had an excellent point when mentioning that this is not really that constructive kind of debate, and I would add that I see this whole discussion as a simple "poll", with only 2 choices either FOR or AGAINST, because the topic itself is one of the most persistent ones in terms of the absence of a real common view in that particular case, between the various societies worldwide.
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Gavz
连接： Feb 10, 2004
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Sex before marriage?!
February 21, 2005 - 09:20 AM
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HELLZ YES...
I don't even know if I wanna get married... Just because marriage is a standard thing to do doesnt mean I would. Isnt it weird that so many people get divorced..
But if you're planning on getting married I'd definatley have sex bfore.. Coz you need some experience.. After a couple of times you know the places to touch and you have the skills and creativity to pleasure each other.. Aint nothing wrong with that.. Its natural... I go out with a lot of girls, doesnt mean I sleep with all of them.. Sometimes I like drinking n dancing with a girl, sometimes I just like to chill on the couch and watch a dvd with a girl.. And sometimes I feel so comfertable that the feeling of having sex is mutual.. thats when i act and have sex.. But I never force a situation.. I always just follow my instinct and do what feels right.. You learn from every situation, so to specify what girl you like, you gotta know how to respect and treat your opposite sex..
Oh sorry!! Also for similar sex, for all the gay girls and guys same thing.. Hope I didnt offend you by talkin from a straight guy perspective..
Love Gavan
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SLOVENC
连接： Nov 25, 2003
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Re: sex before marriage
February 21, 2005 - 09:26 AM
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i think you should have as much sex as possible befor marriage, you never know what's waiting for you after marriage, also it is good to have sexual experience b4 marriage  as sex plays a big role later on, and if u find out you and your partner don't tick sexualy then .. well then this is often where the story ends!
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Ashraf
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Re: sex before marriage
February 22, 2005 - 02:41 AM
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luke,
Is it a game to you to try to 'steal' women from their loved ones?. I am sorry but your reply to wallflower shows alot of arragance and total disrespect for other people way of life.
Gavan,
And I say "HELLZ" No. Many people are getting divorced because spouses are 'cheating' on each other due to the mere fact that most of them were used to having sexual partners before marriage. If someone is so much used to having sex with people he/she are not married to, then they are more likely to do it many times after they get married.
matic,
Well..I hate to disappoint you but I have been married for 7 years and I have never regretted abstaining from sex before getting married.
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Luke Lieberman
连接： Feb 13, 2003
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Re: sex before marriage
February 22, 2005 - 03:09 AM
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sigh - no I am not trying to steal a girl from loved ones - if she loves him then she wouldn't leave would she?
the point is that while these virgin guys are trying to find their.. uh.. well - more experiences guys will come along and just swoop the ladies of their feet - I see it all the time.
That is the reality in life.
Some guy just proposed marraige to my girlfreind litterally two days ago, he has been trying to get into her pants for months - obviously she said no - but the point is there is always someone else trying to make a play for your girl.
My girlfreinds - and this one is the fourth that is serious - are always very attractive and I expect that guys will try to steal them away from me - because I am not naive.
I have learned to take it in stride - sometimes guys who are your "freinds" will be the ones to try to steal the girl - it happens all the time.
And if you are one of those really "sincere" guys who thinks of his girl like she is like some delicate peice of priceless artwork - only to be looked at and adored and never touched -
then you are exactly the kind of guy who will be crying into his pillow when someone with more experience comes along staels her away.
Now my girlfreind considers herself "conservative" - she will not sleep with someone casually, or "just for fun" - she has to be in love - and I am the second guy she has slept with. She loves me and I love her - and we make love.
So Bitsy's comment that there are two kinds of people - those who don't care about sex or who they are sleeping with, and those who do and wait for marraige - is hopelessly naive.
I feel like I am talking to a 4 year old - you can have alot of self respect - and care quite deeply about the person you are with, and the love you are making - without being married.
And I agree with Gaven - Palestinian your are not basing your arguement on anything - you have no experience with what you are talking about.
I know a number of people who waited for marraige - got married young and got divorced inside of 8 months -
I also know that my brother has been happily married for 12 years precisely because he had experience and KNEW WHAT HE WANTED in a girl - BEFORE getting married, and he knew that he was fully compatable with his woman before making the commitment.
He slept with girls all over the world before he was married - it has not motivated him to cheat on his wife - rather he got it out of his system, and he was ready to settle down.
Alot of people who save sex for marraige end up getting married young, and they are always curious what it would be like with someone else - there is always a question - they don't really know themselves -
Where as a person who has matured a little bit with a bit of experience knows - A) how to please a woman B) What he wants in a woman and C) what he wants out of life.
He is a man and not a boy when he makes the descision to commit and as such is far more capable of making the commitment last.
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Lucia
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Sex before marriage?!
February 22, 2005 - 03:22 AM
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Originally posted by Gavan
But if you're planning on getting married I'd definatley have sex bfore.. Coz you need some experience.. After a couple of times you know the places to touch and you have the skills and creativity to pleasure each other.. Aint nothing wrong with that..
and Luke: "Getting married with out any sexual experience is like a blind person picking their favorite color."
"I should just hope on the wedding night that we have physical chemistry - and that the chemistry will last over time - that we will never get bored "
"Now - understand that sexual intimacy is exceedingly important at the beginning of a relationship - after a solid emotional foundation has been laid using sex as a tool toward that end - the physical act of love becomes less important - but that is down the road. Certainly as a relationship begins sex provides an emotional pique and reveals vulnerabilities that uncover your partners true self - it leaves nowhere to hide."
...the list goes on...
After considering these two different views, I have understood that the fundamental difference between people with a view like the one above value the act of sex itself and the individual whom they do it with is unimportant. The focus of this point of view, judging from the arguments cited in defense of this view, is to secure self-satisfaction in sex and a concern that the sexual partner will not be able to provide sexual satisfaction to the other.
People who share my view, however, do not value sex per se, but we value the individual who we will be engaging in this intimate act with. The principle behind this thinking is that you love the other person first with your heart and mind and physical intimacy would come, borne from those emotions and from that bond, and it will be pleasurable because of the emotional closeness you share and because you both value and love one another and not the act of sex.
It is clear that the two sides approach love and love relationships from diametrically opposed philosophies. If you don't like the philosophy of the other, don't get involved and if you want to get involved with someone with the opposing set of values - don't! Just leave them alone and don't try to coerce them to abandon their values and do what you want them to do.
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Gavz
连接： Feb 10, 2004
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Re: sex before marriage
February 22, 2005 - 09:44 AM
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Dear palestinian,
Im really happy for your successful marriage.. But you base your facts on nothing..
"If someone is so much used to having sex with people he/she are not married to, then they are more likely to do it many times after they get married."
I live in a neighbourhood in Amsterdam where a lot of muslim people live. Some of them are close friends of mine, girls and guys. Now these girls stay virgin till they are married, they say. But 2 girlfriends of mine were married and just couldnt stay with that one first partner because they felt they couldn't be themself with their partner. Actually one of the girls has been married 3 times already. Her situation is worse coz she marries every time.. So she ruins a lot more I think.. So it wouldnt matter whether she is or isnt married. I think that's the influence of living in a city of tolerance..
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SLOVENC
连接： Nov 25, 2003
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Re: sex before marriage
February 23, 2005 - 02:30 AM
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Palestinian ,
there is one thing, how do you know you have a great sex life? if u haven't tried it with other women! i am happy that you have a good marriage and congratulations for that! do you have more wifes? and can you practise poligammy in Palestine? well still i think sex before marriage is good, also to find out what you like, but there are exceptions, if u know exactly what you search for, and you know the person you wanna marry can give that to you it's ok. sex is very important in a relationship, and ok, i mean it is true you can't base your relationship on sex, but still, b4 your marriage it's good to have it! personally i don't wanna marry, if i do, then later when i'll be old!
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BasketballStar10
连接： Sep 3, 2004
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Re: sex before marriage
February 23, 2005 - 04:01 AM
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I am sorry but sex before marriage? NO!! it is very wrong so if you think that it is just fine then go have sex and then get some sort of diease. then either go and get married or go have sex with a nother human sorry that is wrongo! sex is meant for after marriage! I personally wouldn't want the guy that I am going to get married to come up and tell me the day of the wedding and say I got aids. and I am marring this guy?.....
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Brian
连接： Jan 22, 2004
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Re: sex before marriage
February 23, 2005 - 04:54 AM
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My beliefs on this whole topic has changed since I was a teenager. I wish I could roll back the clock and hold off on sex.
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eva gatwiri
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Re: sex before marriage
February 24, 2005 - 03:17 AM
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Great thread!! I love hot topics. I have discussed this with friends and I wonder!!! Has anyone ever heard of a person who chose to wait to get married before sex and regretted the decision? On the other hand, how many people do we know are engaged in premarital sex and regret it?? I can say, I do not know anyone who waited and regretted it!! (so the arguement about having to test drive a car before you buy it is not valid.)
check out http://www.leaderu.com/everystudent/sex/articles/wolves.html
http://sloppynoodle.com/subvem2.shtml
and
http://www.sloppynoodle.com/subvev.html and tell us what you think
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abimbola oladejo
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Re: sex before marriage
February 24, 2005 - 06:12 AM
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i strongly believe in you thoughts. for what is there to desire in my 'wife' again after i'd known her sexually before we got married. absolutely nothing new again. the issue of pre-marital sex needs to be discussed and drum into the youths of todays's ears over and over again. thanks.
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Gavz
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Re: sex before marriage
February 24, 2005 - 08:01 AM
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Zionishot,
I think if safe sex is practised the chance of getting a disease is small.. Every step you take in life can be associated with a risk.. I think thats just my mentallity. I've always done it safe and never received or transmitted a disease. The fact that I am not obliged to get married and in my country it's not a society must to do so.. I get the choice whether I want to get marries or not.. And since I dont know if I want to, the whole sex before marriage issue is cancelled..
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Ashraf
连接： Jan 31, 2004
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Re: sex before marriage
February 25, 2005 - 06:06 AM
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Originally posted by matic
Palestinian ,
there is one thing, how do you know you have a great sex life? if u haven't tried it with other women! i am happy that you have a good marriage and congratulations for that! do you have more wifes? and can you practise poligammy in Palestine? well still i think sex before marriage is good, also to find out what you like, but there are exceptions, if u know exactly what you search for, and you know the person you wanna marry can give that to you it's ok. sex is very important in a relationship, and ok, i mean it is true you can't base your relationship on sex, but still, b4 your marriage it's good to have it! personally i don't wanna marry, if i do, then later when i'll be old!
Matic,
Firstly I am only married to one wife. I don't have to 'compare' the marriage sex life with pre-marital sex. You look for the garden to settle in before marriage (without ruining it), and once you find it you settle in it and MOST IMPORTANTLY you stop 'comparing'...because very simply you will always find someone who is 'better' than your life partner somewhere in this world. The problem with pre-marital sex is that you can change partners as you change shoes..sorry for this expression.
and sex is indeed important in marriage but it is absolutely not the most important part of it.
Zionishot,
You are doing yourself a great favour by abstaining from sex until getting married. Trust me when I say you are absolutely doing the right thing.
and yes "sex is meant for after marriage". This is a very true statement!.
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