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Cyril France
Joined: May 5, 2006
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Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 8, 2007 - 01:49 PM
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If this really were a human rights issue, then that clearly means that any human could marry any other human because it is their human or equal right to marry anyone they feel they want to marry!
Do these who pushed gay marriage upon society by basing their premise so falsely by claiming this as a human or equal rights issue on marriage recognize that a brother marrying a sister would too be legal because it is their human or equal right, well being they too are human and must have the right to marry who ever they want because if this becomes a human rights issue, then incest would indiscriminately as humans who too are equal to all other humans be included.
Do you support brothers marrying sisters? Do you support cousins marrying cousins? Do you support parents marrying their offspring etc.?
Sure we all are aware that incest exists and by claiming marriage be a human rights or equal rights issue and supporting it, we are saying we support incest marriage too because they too are humans and as equal as any gay as gays claim to be as human and as equal as heterosexuals! You see if we are saying that this marriage this is a human or equal rights issue we are saying we support all the deformed children that come from incest relationships because otherwise you can't justify call this an equal or human rights issue and discriminate humans!
Pathetic, and as weak as our governing system is in pathetically passing off cheap fabrications as justification, I will stand strong for my country and the globe we all live on because I care to make sure things are actually justified for the benefit of us all instead of for selfish groups at the expense of the rest of the globe to suffer! I have not lost hope yet on this nation issue, and I applaud all those opposed to that motion!
It is time for us all to start seeing through what selfish groups make things out to be to suit their own selfish means while keeping hidden future repercussions.
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Shweta
Joined: May 20, 2006
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 9, 2007 - 05:24 AM
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One point of view has been presented here. of course, there are other points of views too and people can share those.
I think it might be unhelpful to link incest with marriages between gays/lesbians. These are seperate issues and probably need to be dealt differently.
Human rights framework says that "people are people first". They can not be lebelled and stigmatized baecause of differences. One aspect cannot define the whole identity of anyone.
We need to respect diversity among human beings.
This post was edited on: 2007-06-11 at 02:57 AM by: Shweta-sj
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Torsten
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 9, 2007 - 05:57 PM
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May I resume your point how I understood it? (Just to make sure I did not misunderstand you.) : Homosexual marriages are wrong, because, to justify them, we have to justify incest.
Honestly I don't see any connection between the two. Incest is prohibited since the possible children of relatives could suffer because of their genes.
Homosexual marriages are allowed (at least in some countries) to give homosexual couples the chance to bind to each other, and life a more normal live than otherwise.
Arakasi
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Jack
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 9, 2007 - 11:49 PM
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I agree with Arakasi.
This post was edited on: 2007-06-09 at 11:49 PM by: Jack1289
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Sandy Mae
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 10, 2007 - 12:20 PM
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I believe that society has placed us in boxes with labels. Because you have a masculine anatomy, you can only love people of the opposite sex. Because you are poor, you cannot mingle with the rich. these are just some of the struggles that some of our brothers/ sisters are currently facing.
I guess what im trying to say here is that we should try to free ourselves from the dictates of society. Same sex marriage is alright as long as it does not impinge on the rights of others.
As for incest, it is another story because as has been earlier stated in this forum, there are genetic repercussions. It is in no way similar to same sex marriage.
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Amanda
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 12, 2007 - 01:02 AM
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I'm somewhat disgusted by this comparison to be completely honest. The fundamental belief of human rights and one I live my life by is that you have the right to live a happy life, seek personal fulfillment and express yourself as long as no one is harmed in the process.
I'll tell you why incest is a form of harm though everyone else has already pointed it out. Incest reduces genetic variation which is extremely harmful to a child. (Just let me know if you'd like an explanation of what genetic variation is and why it's important) Not to be rude but old royal families (we'll use Nicholas the 2nd the last czar of Russia as an example) were exceptionally prone to diseases because of inferior DNA due to having a child with cousins and other close relatives. His son was born with hemophilia and experienced poor health his entire life.
Please tell us any way you see gay or lesbian marriages as harmful to society or people so we can understand why you're so against it. But as far as I'm concerned "the state has no place in the bedrooms of the nation(s)" -Pierre Elliot Trudeau a personal preference is simply that, and as long as it's mutual and not harmful no one has any right to stop a lesbian or gay person from being themselves.
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Cyril France
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 12, 2007 - 09:26 AM
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If incest and pedophilia remain illegal then that is factual evidence proving sexual preference is not an equal or human rights issue. Disgusting!
Gays get the chance to come out of the closet when they feel comfortable and yet they are forcing gay adoptions so children have to suffer the bias radical lifestyle with no choice in the matter thus being pushed out of their gay so called parents closet. But they gays don't care about how terrifying for the children this is as long as gays get their own selfish way meanwhile they seem to conveniently forget they got to come out of the closet when they felt comfortable. Disgusting!
Gays claim it is natural to be gay and yet they are protesting homophobia, which is natural for heterosexuals to feel about gays, and claiming it should be illegal / not tolerated. It is obvious that if homophobia should not be tolerated, being gay should not be tolerated for the very same reason that it is claimed to be natural!
It is time for this nightmare to come to an end.
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Torsten
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 12, 2007 - 11:14 AM
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If incest and pedophilia remain illegal then that is factual evidence proving sexual preference is not an equal or human rights issue. Disgusting!
Pedophilia is prohibited because sex is dangerous for children and they cannot decide whether they want to have sex. Additionaly, adults would often force children to have sex with them. Lastly an intimate relationship with an adult could easily become a dependence - relationship.
Incest was already mentioned above.
In conclusion, both are not connected to the matter of homosexuality at all (at least from my point of view).
About the problems with adoption: If their environement wasn't as biased as it is, the children would be accepted.
(I don't get your idea about the closet - what do you want to say?)
Regarding homophobia - if it was tolerated homosexuals would not be tolerated, hence it is a moot point.
Arakasi
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Amanda
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 12, 2007 - 12:20 PM
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The exact same reason pedophilia isn’t allowed as incest. There's harm to another person therefore there are laws against it.
Maybe this will help you understand how I see the difference. There’s three adults two female one male.
Is woman number one an intelligent person capable of making choices of expressing her opinions and of having emotions? Is she capable of saying no or yes to a relationship based on whether or not she wants it?
Is all the same true for woman number 2? Is she equal to woman number 1?
And is all the same true for the man involved is he equal to woman number 1 and 2?
That's why I find gay or lesbian marriages acceptable because there between two equal people, which is absolutely no different then a heterosexual relationship.
On the matter of adopting children I'm curious have you ever met a child who has gay or lesbian parents? As far as I'm aware although there's some social pressure that it might be wrong, at home it's just normal these are the loving and caring parents that they've grown up with there entire life.
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Laura Mannell
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Re: Gay Marriage and Human Rights...
June 14, 2007 - 03:54 PM
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If I am correct, it was argued that a child of a gay couple will have a somewhat rough childhood becuase their parents are "different". So how would having gay parents differ from interracial couples, or couples with large age differences, or couples where one or more has some form of disability, or single parents, or teenage mothers or fathers, or chilren born due to affairs or rape? All of these characteristics are often viewed as "different" as well, but are children of those parents/couples exposed to a rough childhood of teasing and ridicule as well. If you have an honest rejection for gay couples having children, then you have to have an honest rejection for all of the above criteria for the very same principles and reasoning.
Kids will be kids and will tease other children for various reasons. Those children who would tease based on an other child's homelife only do so because it is influenced by their own "normal" parents.
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