« BACK TO FORUM
 Author |
 Post
|
 |
|
Anu maheshwari
Joined: Jun 14, 2005
Posts: 1149 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Blabbermouth
User is
Offline
 Virtual Volunteer
Gender & Age: Female & 28
Country: India
Province/State: Maharashtra
City: Pune
|
Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 18, 2007 - 12:51 PM
|
|
Is it right to carry forward this word 'black' to refer to people? what do you all think ?
[link="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_people"]
According to the Untied States' one drop rule, a black is any person with any known African ancestry.[25] Sociologist F. James Davis in his 1991 book Who Is Black? argues that this definition, is "inextricably woven into the history of the United States. It incorporates beliefs once used to justify slavery and later used to buttress the castelike Jim Crow system of segregation." "Most Americans," according to Davis, "seem unaware that this definition of blacks is extremely unusual in other countries, perhaps even unique to the United States, and that Americans define no other minority group in a similar way"[26]
Not only does the one-drop rule not apply outside of America, but it often applies in reverse. Just as anyone with any physically recognizable sub-Saharan ancestry can claim to be Black in America, anyone with any recognizable Caucasian ancestry is considered White in Latin America. Even individual with enough African ancestry to make them as dark as Sidney Poitier can pass for White if they appear to have at least one physically visible Caucasian trait such as straight hair or narrow facial features. According to Jose Neinstein, a native white Brazilian and executive director of the Brazilian-American Cultural Institute in Washington, in America, "if you are not quite white, then you are black." But in Brazil, "If you are not quite black, then you are white." Neinstein recalls talking with a man of Poitier's complexion when in Brazil: "We were discussing ethnicity, and I asked him, 'What do you think about this from your perspective as a black man?' He turned his head to me and said, 'I'm not black,' . . . It simply paralyzed me. I couldn't ask another question."[27]
[i]Scientific racism and racial classification
The modern concept of race has its origins in the Age of Enlightenment, which gave rise to biological classifications, scientific racism and the theory of evolution.[5] At the end of the 17th century, a French doctor named Francois Bernier divided up humanity based on facial appearance and body type. He proposed four categories: Europeans, Far Easterners, Lapps, and blacks who he described as having woolly hair, thick lips, and very white teeth.[6]
.........................
This post was edited on: 2007-02-18 at 12:52 PM by: anuriandima84 (Moderator)
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
Anu maheshwari
Joined: Jun 14, 2005
Posts: 1149 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Blabbermouth
User is
Offline
Virtual Volunteer
Gender & Age: Female, 28
Country: India
Province/State: Maharashtra
City: Pune
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 18, 2007 - 12:52 PM
|
|
Swiss botanist Carolus Linnaeus divided humankind into four, main "races" loosely based on geographic distribution: europeaus, the white race; asiaticus, the yellow race; americanus, the red race; and afer (for Africa), the black race.[7] According to Linnaeus' pseudo-scientific model, the black male could be defined by his skin tone, face structure, and curly hair. Today, Linneaus generally is widely regarded as a racist.[8] He assigned various fanciful attributes to each of his four categories, clearly favoring the "race" europeaus.[9] Linnaeus described blacks as cunning, passive, inattentive, and ruled by impulse. He pronounced black females shameless because, he reasoned, "they lactate profusely".[10]
Criticism of definitions
Some feels the term sub-Saharan is rooted in racismThere are objections to the standard definitions of black people, as well as criticism of the term itself.
Cultural writer and filmmaker Owen 'Alik Shahadah says "as a political term it was fiery and trendy but never was it an official racial classification of peoples who have a 120,000 year old history. Indians are from India, Chinese from China. There is no country called Blackia or Blackistan. Hence, the ancestry-nationality model is more respectful and accurate: African-American, African-British, African-Brazilian, and African-Caribbean." 'Alik Shahadah also objects that "in addition, because it is a term placed on us, we have no bases for its control, and hence they are able to say; 'Ancient Egyptians weren't black.' Black has no meaning; except the meaning they place on it, if and when they chose."[56]
Owen 'Alik Shahadah states "the notion of some invisible border, which divides the North of African from the South, is rooted in racism, which in part assumes that a little sand is an obstacle for African people. This barrier of sand hence confines/confined Africans to the bottom of this make-believe location, which exist neither politically or physically". Shahadah argues that the term sub-Saharan Africa is a product of European imperialism, "Sub-Saharan Africa is a byword for primitive African: a place, which has escaped advancement. Hence, we see statements like 'no written languages exist in Sub-Saharan Africa.' 'Egypt is not a Sub-Saharan African civilization.'[56][/i]
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
manosijm
Joined: Feb 16, 2007
Posts: 80 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Chatterbox
User is
Offline
Gender & Age: Male, 24
Country: Canada
Province/State: Quebec
City: Montréal
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 18, 2007 - 01:12 PM
|
|
I do not think the differences between Egypt and sub-Saharan Africa are always meant to be racially disparaging.
Egyptians speak Arabic, have their own distinct cuisine and art, and share a national identity that involves pride in the ancient Egyptian civilisation.
People in sub-Saharan Africa also have their own distinct cuisine and art, and a fascinating history, which is distinct from that of the Egyptians.
So yes, Egypt and sub-Saharan Africa are different. It's not a matter of superiority or inferiority. They are just different in their ways of life. Like Norwegians and Italians are different. Or Bangladeshis and Malaysians are different. So?
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
Owulezi
Joined: Apr 4, 2006
Posts: 438 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Blabbermouth
User is
Offline
Country: Nigeria
Province/State: Imo
City: Owerri
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 18, 2007 - 02:48 PM
|
|
I simply see black in human color as reaction to match weather/ sunny areas in the world like some part of Africa. 
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
Saladin
Joined: Oct 1, 2002
Posts: 997 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Blabbermouth
User is
Offline
Virtual Volunteer
Gender & Age: Male, 27
Country: Egypt
Province/State: Al Qahirah
City: Cairo
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 19, 2007 - 05:20 AM
|
|
manosijm wrote:
I do not think the differences between Egypt and sub-Saharan Africa are always meant to be racially disparaging.
Egyptians speak Arabic, have their own distinct cuisine and art, and share a national identity that involves pride in the ancient Egyptian civilisation.
People in sub-Saharan Africa also have their own distinct cuisine and art, and a fascinating history, which is distinct from that of the Egyptians.
So yes, Egypt and sub-Saharan Africa are different. It's not a matter of superiority or inferiority. They are just different in their ways of life. Like Norwegians and Italians are different. Or Bangladeshis and Malaysians are different. So?
There were actually lots of ancient civilizations in what might be termed as sub-saharan africa, like the Mali and the Nubian civilizations.
About the Egyptian question, you can still find drastic differences inside the country itself:
In the Oasis of Siwa in the Northwest, you have the Siwi people with their Amazigh language and heritage, in the South, you have the physically African Nubians, with their distinctive Nubian features, language, and traditions. In addition, you have the bedouins of the Mariut region, the Eastern Desert and Sinai with their unique ties with the culture of their ancestors in the Arabian peninsula, and of course, you have the two brand famous categories of rural population: Fellahin in the North and Sa'ayda in the South.
What I am trying to say basically, is that even in Egypt, I have relatives who have very European features, and others with African features.
For myself, my father's ancestors are Yemeni, and my mother's are Moroccans, and in between one of my grandfathers was married to an Albanian lady. Henceforth, it is fair enough to admit that everyone of us has no "pure" ethnicity, and that we all share the same humanity.
This post was edited on: 2007-02-22 at 05:35 PM by: aymanelhakea
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
Ajay Kamalakaran
Joined: Oct 19, 2004
Posts: 227 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Chatterbox
User is
Offline
Gender & Age: Male, 33
Country: India
Province/State: Maharashtra
City: Bombay
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 19, 2007 - 07:51 AM
|
|
aymanelhakea wrote:
it is fair enough to admit that everyone of us has no "pure" ethnicity, and that we all share the same humanity.
Very well said, Ayman
Anu
I don't think it's racist to call a sub-Saharan African a Black just as it's not racist to call an "ethnic European", a White.
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
manosijm
Joined: Feb 16, 2007
Posts: 80 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Chatterbox
User is
Offline
Gender & Age: Male, 24
Country: Canada
Province/State: Quebec
City: Montréal
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 19, 2007 - 07:59 PM
|
|
A recent scientific lecture in my University was based on the fact that all human beings are 98% chimp.
So much for superiority complexes
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
Anu maheshwari
Joined: Jun 14, 2005
Posts: 1149 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Blabbermouth
User is
Offline
Virtual Volunteer
Gender & Age: Female, 28
Country: India
Province/State: Maharashtra
City: Pune
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 19, 2007 - 11:35 PM
|
|
ajay78 wrote:<
Anu
I don't think it's racist to call a sub-Saharan African a Black just as it's not racist to call an "ethnic European", a White.
Ajay,
I am not saying that the term carries racist implication in the present age. It might and it might not depending on the thinking of individuals or groups.
In this thread I am just venturing out to initiate a discussion to explore the origin of the classification of people on the basis of colour.
Since we are discussing the celebration of "Black history Month".
Just wanted to see what people think about it.
When i was a kid , it was alright for me to call First Nation's people 'red indians' since media referred to them likewise. But later after reading the books written by them I realised that many
consider it offensive and prefer being called "First nation's people" .
Again , I was watching one of the episode of the Oprah Show in which the cast of Crash was discussing the word 'nigger' and whether the word should be banned or not. WHile some wanted to retain it , others considered it offensive.
So this thread was to seek out opinions from the present generation on the issue of being labelled according to one's colour.
I personally am of the opinion that these
terminologies would die a natural death in the era of Globalisation whre idenitities are fast dissolving.
P.S
I will always remain touche about government forms asking me my religion and caste. I always leave those columns blank... because i find those questions highly irrelevant.
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
Patricia Sudi
Joined: Nov 30, 2004
Posts: 112 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Chatterbox
User is
Offline
Virtual Volunteer
Country: Kenya
Province/State: Nairobi Area
City: Nairobi
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
February 27, 2007 - 09:15 AM
|
|
There is some resemblence to this arguememt even here in Kenya and to make matters worse if you are African and you are very light in Kenya especia;lly the ladies,you tend to get preferential treatment and an association with you having had maybe a relationship with the white ancestry.To Kenyans,A white person is different from the Afro American.And if you happen to be afro American but you are very light skinned and with coarse hair then you are white.It also depends with how you have been brought up,the environment you were brought under to view white,hindu and African as three totally diffrent groups of people.
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
UFJ
Joined: Feb 26, 2007
Posts: 106 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Chatterbox
User is
Offline
Gender: Male
Country: United States
|
What Shall We Call Him?
March 5, 2007 - 12:46 PM
|
|
So often the various journalists find trouble in selecting the proper name for the Moorish American. Some say “Negro, another will brand him “Race Man”, still another will call him “Afro-American”, “Coon”, “Shine”, “The Brethren”, and your “Folks”.
It is indeed a hard matter to find something suitable for the various occasions where a title needs to be used. Is it that these people have a National name when first brought to these shores in the early part of the Seventeenth Century? If so, what was it? Did not the Land from which they were forced have a name? It now appears a good idea for those whose duty it is to write for the Various journals to find out what the National name of the fore-fathers of these primary demean other people by America was.
Also look into history of the founders of civilization and see who they were and where they stood in the building of the present civilization. Probably two hours in an up-to-date library would serve to relieve the strain on our men and women of letters, when the occasion presents itself for a title for these people.
The matter of the various names given to these twenty-two million so-called people in the United States of America with all hues of every race of the globe was an act of Anglo Saxon psychology. They gave him a name, then defined it as something inferior to theirs. “White”, they defined as a color of purity; “Black”, they say, represents everything evil. The so-called “Negro”, as they were called in this nation, have no nation they published to which they might look with pride.
Their history starts with the close of the Civil war according to America or more properly with Moors being forced to serve some one else. Thus he was separated from the illustrious rich history of his forefathers (Royal Moors) conquerors of Spain in the 8th century who were the founders of the first civilization of the Old World.
This matter should be looked into with a hope of correcting it because of our long and tragic history of expulsions, forced conversions, denial of treaty protections, limitations of civil and political rights, lies and slanders and mass murders.
Therefore, (Moor) remember you are not my dog, thugs, negroes, black, colored or Ethiopians.
This post was edited on: 2007-03-05 at 12:51 PM by: UFJ
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
Pinkness!
Joined: Mar 1, 2007
Posts: 7 (view all)
Poster Rank:
Soft-spoken
User is
Offline
Gender & Age: Female, 20
Country: United States
Province/State: Utah
|
Re: Who is Black ? and Scientific racism !
March 12, 2007 - 04:21 PM
|
|
I was just thinking about this subject today....which is why i came to this page....i find it very offensive that we still refur to African-Americans as "black"..........it is the same as calling someone brown or yellow or red......its just offensive
|
|
back to top |
link to this post
|
|
|
Display posts from:
|
|
