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Sean
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Peace and War.
April 1, 2003 - 12:06 PM
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Alot has been said. I am very impressed at the calm rationale discussion this potentially explosive topic has generated. It speaks to the level of thought and maturity of the individuals on the TIG site. I must say I support the war against Saddam, (it's not really against Iraq). I believe this is something which should have happened ten years ago, unfortunately at the time Bush Sr was coming out of office and Clinton was going in.
After the first gulf war there was clearly a "Vietnam" fear everytime the U.S. goes to war, noone wants to repeat that event so we kinda just do the hit and run instead of going in to accomplish the task at hand.
I was speaking to another friend about this whole thing and My Pastor has been speaking some basic truths over the past month, even prior to the war. It's sad that we have to go through war to achieve any peace.
There will always be some dictator around the world wanting to try there own way in running there country, which is absolutley their right. Just don't start killing, poisoning, starving, or hurting your people (or us)and the rest of us will be pretty much ok, with observing the Prime Directive.
I m grateful that President Bush has an allie in Prime Minister Blair, and am moreso disappointed in Canadas inabilty to stand up "on guard for thee", like we say we do! This dispite the fact that we already have troops, in the "theatre", and have been offering more support than many of the so called "Coalition" nations.
I wish we as a country had leaders who were truly willing to make the tough decisions, though unpopular! I am seeing this as a problem even in local agencies, I think we should make my Mayor the Mayor of Mississauga, Hazel McCallion Prime Minister. Hazel would clear things up right quick!
Lastly as a Chiristian i am not at all surprised by these happenings in what we know to be the last days, there is much more going on hear than we can see in the natural. All one has to do is start reading at Matthew24: 6. For the person who said they don't know what we can do, the best thing we can do right now! as a nation is pray! We need to pray that...
1. through all the disinformation we hear and see that God's truth will be revealed in a timely manner.
2. That we will not be decieved by the hand(s) of evil.
3. That we will be protected from the things ( Mainly alot of the clandestine agencies working behind the scenes of this war) of this world.
So Cheers, be blessed, and remember, In this world we will have trouble but we can take heart because He has (shown us how to )overcome the world.
Semper-Whyte.
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Nir Dagan
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100% agreement
April 1, 2003 - 01:15 AM
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I can't agree more with what you said.
As mentioned, the war is not against the Iraqi people, but against a dictator - Saddam Hussein. In my opinion all these dictators should be taken care of, because negotiation isn't part of their vocabulary.
Last, props to Blier that understands the situation and suppors bush.
P.S - Whatever your belifes are, keep praying for peace in the world (Jewish, Christian, Muslim etc).
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Mike
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Re: Peace and War.
April 1, 2003 - 04:35 AM
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sigh.
prayer.
gah!
When one thinks they have reached the threshold of human ability, pray not, for you have only taken the next step to changing the world by your own hand.
We're not at the threshold yet.
There is no sense in this war as there was reason for the last one, or the one before. War is the easy way out, no matter how costly or incredibly dehumanising it may seem.
War is something we must stop reverting to in an effort to solve our differences. If one wants a permanent solution to anything, whether the conflict is between two people or two nations, dialogue is the only means.
- - -
Pred.
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Mickel Hendrix (for now)
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peace and war
April 4, 2003 - 02:11 AM
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Hotep,
Okay. Let's be straight forward here. You support the war against Iraq on the grounds that Saddam is a vile dictator. Well, what about Bush and the C.I.A. and all the vile things that they've done all over the globe? Whatever SAddam has done directly is no more than what Bush and company has done indirectly, using the C.I.A. Go find out for yourself by doing some simple research. The so-called war on terrorism is nothing more than a cover sheet for the purpose of imperialism, with Amerikkka and Britain at the controls, and their military police as their protectors. Need I start naming names, as to who the "they" are? The war on Iraq has nothing to do with terrorism nor the 911 occurrence, because Bush had planned to invade Iraq long before those planes crashed into federal property. But, as long as their are media entities like CNN and BBC, which the imperialists control, the masses will always be suckered into believing anything the real terrorists desire. It's the same thing they did to the Germans, duriing WWI by portraying them as a threat to world peace and as a potential enemy who wanted to destroy western civilization, which is basically White-Anglo-Saxon-Prodestant-European. When the real terrorists are finished bombing Iraq, the imperialist lottery will soon begin, with hefty contracts that will range somewhere between 60-80 billion dollars. Violence breeds violence. Terrorism breeds terrorism. Destruction breeds destruction. Terrorists are not born in the womb. And why was their no Arab terrorists before the 1948? Furthermore, the United Snakes of Amerikkka was the entity that virtually put the Saddam-headed Baath Party into power by way of a Coup in 1963 against the Iraqi government, which was in power at the time. Everywhere the C.I.A. has been you can find terrorism used as a method to conduct imperialist-driven motives. I don't even have to mention all the nations in Afruika, which have been enslaved by the likes of the IMF and World Bank, in order to control the mineral wealth that Amerikkka needs in order to survive. What is really so funny about the whole fiasco is that the coalition forces haven't found any weapons of mass destruction yet. Why would Saddam wait until Iraq has been bombed into oblivion then unleash what Amerikkka has sold him, straight from the labs at Fort Detrick, Maryland, the home of the world's largest chemical and biological weapons program. I don't think most people are ready to accept the truth. So, they just keep on trucking on in a psyched-out state of mind, asking self-explanatory questions like "why do they hate us," and campaigning under the slogan "God bless Amerikkka." But, we'll see who God blesses, after all the imperialists have done everywhere, and to every non-European nation, on this planet. Who's the blame for the hate that hate made?
P.E.A.C.E. Proper Education Always Corrects Errors!
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Ifrah
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Re: Peace and War.
April 4, 2003 - 10:09 AM
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The war is on the Iraqi people, if it wasn't on them then why are so many of them getting kiled? Bush was just trying to lie so that he can start wars and trun countries into a desert and he wants to scare other countries that challenge him. I think its wrong that there is war, I think that Bush should have a talk with Saddam look at both sides and compromise. WAR IS NOT THE ANSWER!!!
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annie
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Re: Peace and War.
April 4, 2003 - 11:06 AM
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I can’t image the pain and the suffering people go through during war. I don’t know why people would choose to have a war. Places are destroyed; people get injured and sometimes even die because of war. When will war ever end? I can’t find why everyone can’t compromise when there’s conflict and resolve the problem in a different way.
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jac14
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Re: Peace and War.
April 5, 2003 - 02:41 AM
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i agree with ndagen, the war is not against the Iraqi's, but their leader!
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Helen
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No War!!!
April 5, 2003 - 05:27 AM
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 I just can't say how happy I am, when Jean Chretien said that Canada will not be joining in the war against Iraq. Wars can kill so many people in Iraq and also America. If only the president can see what the war is actually doing to the people in Iraq. George W. Bush will surely be very scared if it were his daughters in Iraq as citizens there. So, I think that if everyone understood the causes of wars, there will be no more wars. I just don't understand why people will start wars, instead of stopping wars and figuring things out? 
Peace had almost never happened in the past of this world. So, is that a reason to stop trying to have peace in this world and start more wars. There had been wars going on in this planet long enough, and they haven't solved one problem. So, why don't we start the peace today to make this world a better world for our kids to live in? Do you really want your kids to be pointing guns at everyone they see, because they are scared? Our kids are our future and we want a nice, peaceful, and content place for them to live in. Not a scary world where there is wars happening everywhere, and it is not even safe to stay in their homes. :eek:
Please put some considerations for the kids and stop the wars! 
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Melissa S.
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Re: Peace and War.
April 7, 2003 - 01:14 AM
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To helenfu:
I was also sooooooooo happy when Jean Chretien said "Canada wiil not be helping the US with the war!!
War is evil too many people die!!!
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Udara
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Re: Peace and War.
April 8, 2004 - 04:25 AM
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Hope our pro-war supporting friends would understand why only their countries get attacked. Violence never solved any crisis, it begets hatred and more violence.
The viscous circle continues…AND.... So many valuables life’s would be lost..
Peace,
Udara
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JJ
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Re: Peace and War.
April 9, 2004 - 01:21 AM
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Well said Pred, Ptah! If one can objectively look at the irony and contradictions war and religion, put together, inherently present, one may see the eminent danger religion poses for human existence and peace. Many may be surprised how "religious" people can support war, but it is quite simple how this takes place... Prayer and meditation are wonderful, wonderful techniques and should be practiced by all; but, when parayer and meditation are combined with religion, human ideas, human power, human manipulations, propaganda, etc., are so commonly/elusively/even mistakingly slipped in, obstructing the purity and truth of prayer, meditation...thus, obstructing natural, wholesome truths and insights, through human interference/religion. That is how religion, all religions, can and do lead to ever more hate and destruction in this world. With that said, please understand SW1, I hope you do not take this with any animosity!  We are all in this together, it is one glorious, awful, pleasant, agonizing...yet beautiful journey
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Evan
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Re: Peace and War.
April 9, 2004 - 01:22 AM
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"War does not determine who is right; war determines who is left."
I will not deny that Saddam was a problem- he was really not a completely sane man. It is too bad that such a war had to be started, as opposed to a quiet operation to remove the violent regime. But I don't know if it would have ever been possible to remove Saddam without having to take some of the measures that were taken.
If Iraq was never invaded, what would it be like now? Would Saddam still be using chemical weapons on his people? Killing thousands of innocent people? Iraq is better off now, than it was before.
For me, the bottom line is that Saddam killed an exponential amount of people in cold blood, in comparison to the unfortunate deaths caused by the 'coalition' occupation of Iraq. The operation could have gone a lot more smoothly, but it was better than nothing, I think.
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JJ
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Re: Peace and War.
April 9, 2004 - 01:56 AM
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Yes, a very good point Druid...but, why is the U.S./Bush targetting only Iraq, when right now there are countless other dehumanizing, authoritarian/autocratic leaders in the world? What about the citizens of those nation-states? Why Iraq? Were there any WMD?...no, I think not. Why must the U.S. ignore any other nations equal amount of suffering? Suffering is suffering...
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Udara
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Re: Peace and War.
April 13, 2004 - 05:47 AM
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Nation 109 tonnes Share of world total Comment
Saudi Arabia 36.0 24.9% Osama bin Laden's native country. Fifteen of the nineteen Sept. 11 hijackers were Saudis. Many islamic fundamentalists.
Iraq 15.2 10.7% The centre of attention
United Arab Emirates 13.0 9.3% Overall authority is held by the Supreme Council of seven emires, each of whom is an absolute monarch in his own state. The UAE supported Iraq against Iran, but supported the US in the 1991 Gulf War.
The leadership is pro-Western while anti-American Islamism is strong in the populace. (From SBS World Guide, 10th edition)
Kuwait 13.3 9.2% "Saved" by USA previously
Iran 12.3 8.5% USA supplied Iraq with chemical weapons that were used against Iran
Total Middle East 93.4 65.3% Could be destabilized by the war
Venezuela 11.2 7.4% Politically unstable
The contradiction in the UAE and Kuwait figures was in the original.
In spite of Saudi Arabia's oil wealth poverty has recently started becoming apparent. The ruling family, which imposes a medieval style of monarchy on the country, is terribly corrupt and greedy.
Serious political instability is a distinct possibility in the not-to-distant future. If the current Saudi Arabian Government is overthrown and is replaced by a fundamentalist Islamic government, as in Iran, it is quite possible that they might get together with the other Muslim nations and place an oil embargo on the USA
Now, Why did USA attacked Iraq ????
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Prometheus
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Re: Peace and War.
June 19, 2005 - 09:43 AM
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War simply leads to death. everything is solved by simply two people talking and making a negotiation. but because of how badly Bush wants to capture/kill Saddam, there is no chance that Saddam is going to come out of hiding. Each person who has said that the war is against Saddam not Iraq is right. Bush should not be using anything that would harm citizens of Iraq. if he simply finished what he has started so that no more destruction would come to the cities. all i can really say to Saddam is GET OUT OF HIDDING!!!!!!!!!! if he wasn't hiding, the US would have found him and captured him by now. as for the Canadians, im also glad, like many of you, that we are not involved. to many people would die. everybody would be upset. we are Peace KEEPERS, not Peace Makers. if there was a treaty signing, or some negotiation, then i think that we should get involved.
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