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Marco
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EQUITY! Humans have to believe!
August 18, 2005 - 08:15 AM
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I believe, humans have to believe. For me 'to believe something' means NOT to know exactly, but to be confident about something to be right. Humans cannot know everything. But Humans have to take decisions, even about things, they do not really know about. For instance to vote political parties is very difficult, because it's mostly not even possible to know their real motivation and ideas and what they will do after the election. So people get their opinion about it from here and there and finally they have to decide for one or the other, BELIEVING to choose at least the less worse...
Only very often 'to believe' seem to be something else than I think it should. Even for the most of the people any discussion ENDs up with: “But I believe ...”. They say it is their right 'to believe' or 'not to know exactly' and other should tolerate their opinion. In my opinion, somebody, who wants to believe that way, is not interested in being criticised. Such an attitude is a part of the problem of this world and of the humankind. Not to reflect openly on the ideas of others means to waste time with “old knowledge”. and it means not to try ones best, to make the world a better one. Usually i end up a discussion, when there is nobody really interested in what i believe. Because then i dont want to listen, too.
I would also say, that it's not really a proper way to think that somebody (the president, the priester, Bob Marley, Jesus, Mohammed, Buddha ... or Oneself) have found the eternal truth, because it means, one is not open to new ideas that way. So we have to believe to decide for the moment, but we have to criticise to know more the next time...
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King TUT JR.
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YOU ARE A CHOICE INDIVDUL
August 18, 2005 - 09:56 AM
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RELIGION FOR MANKIND IS A PRIVAT MATTER TO CHOSE FOR CHOICE INDIVIDUAL,IT YOU PRIVAT RELATION WITH
GOOD - ALLAH THE CREATOR, ITS WHAT WILL SET YOU FREE AT THE END AFTER YOUR JOUNEY IN LIFE AND AFTER
DEATH IN THE ACCOUNTING DAY FOR YOU, Let’s respect then ourselves and other people in the world , and educate ourselves about
other religions, before exploding unfounded and baseless arguments.
Islam regards all of humanity as one family as Allah SWT created mankind to get to know each other,
including the Chinese and their role in spreading Islam is no less than other races.
The only thing that separates one muslim from the other is their strength of faith (piety)
in god/Islam, In short, there should be NO descrimination or hate among muslims just because they are of different race
color or nationality, meaning, what It said is right!
Why then is there so much persecution against the Christian Church? Why are hundreds of thousands dying to Islamic
radicals?
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Marco
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sorry, but you give a very good example
August 19, 2005 - 06:30 AM
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fredex
you refere not a single time to what i've said. thats why you give a good example of believing, the way a simply cannot accept. thats why i'll NOT refere to what you have said, too.
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Marco
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HELP
August 19, 2005 - 07:21 AM
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a lot of people are reading that thread - nobody is replying (except one, who is not interested). please, can somebody help me to understand why? is it confusing or something?
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Olexi
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:)
August 21, 2005 - 01:58 AM
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Is it a religious debate? What about being an enlightened atheist?
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annika
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Re: EQUITY! Humans have to believe!
August 21, 2005 - 12:45 PM
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hi,
well, i don't know why people aren't replying.
i completely agree with you on the fact that a person can never KNOW everything there is to know and therefor should try as much as possible not to make assumptions and form an opinion. however, when one is confronted with a decision, one obviously has to 'pick a side' and thereby choosing the lesser evil.
but i don't think it is the most important thing to believe, because believing is because your forced to almost by being asked to make a choice. i think, and i hope you understand that i've thought about your opinion as well, that the most important thing is being openminded, yet not gullible and remaining critical.
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Marco
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thank you for replying
August 22, 2005 - 06:18 AM
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annika!
I'm sure we agree in that point. my idea is just to admit that we, beside our critical attitude, have something in common with religious people. but also to confront the same religious people with a (the?) problem of beiing religious.
olexi!
your question is answered now to i guess. i am an atheist, but i really understand, why so many people get religious even if they can choose (not everybaody can!). its a crazy world, you know? what means enlightened for you?
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Marco
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mhm
September 16, 2005 - 06:29 AM
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actually i hope to get in discussion with openminded religious people, christian, islamic or else. maybe one of you might explain your problems with that kind of discussion? id be very happy about more feedback, thanx
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Hoda El Sherif
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Re: EQUITY! Humans have to believe!
September 28, 2005 - 09:00 AM
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ok..Ikindof agree with what you all have been saying ...but the thing is ..that when people beleive in something ...it doesnt ness mean that they have thought it over ...or chose good over evil ..or influenced by other opinions or debates ..its more a state of mind ..that comes from the subconcious ..its culture,religion,race,language...and a lot of other factors ...all grouped together..that are apart of you as a person ...and that dierctly influences what you beleive in .But.. to appreciate what you beleive in ...and to strengthen your beleif...you've gotta open up ..and realize that there are other people out there ...that beleive in different things..for a lot of diff reasons ....and that the diversity of those beleifs ...is what makes you beleive more!!!
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Marco
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Yes
September 29, 2005 - 04:19 AM
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yes hodazzz,
you really get my point. but would you agree, we should be very radical in checking our believes all over again and again? then you might be no religious person, i guess. because, to follow a religion means to believe in that other way. it means to take a book a person as the source of eternal knowledge. and thats nonsense in my eyes.
ps: for those who think im a 100% antireligious person: Im not! because of one reason: I think its very neccessary to do some kind of praying everyday. not in the meaning of obediance and worshipping something beyond of critic reflection. praying in that case would mean to reflect with your mind and your heart together as one. it means to be in love, to feel and think gratitude and beg to the future to favour your wishes, or something. it doesnt mean to switch of the critical mind at all!!! so from that critical attitude I am antireligious.
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Hoda El Sherif
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Re: EQUITY! Humans have to believe!
October 1, 2005 - 09:15 AM
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glad I got your point ...perferct !...but you know what ... I dont think of religion...as THE knowledge ...like what you were saying ...the source of eternal knowledge .... it doesnt have to be that way....it shouldnt be that way ...the way I think of religion...is the guiding light ...that lights up your path ...the path you choose ...whichever one it's your own choice ...the path you take ...insearch of that knowledge ...so you reach that knowledge ...but not by reading it out of a holy book....but by going through a path ...and being guided by the holy book ...or (any other beleif)....in the end...they r your own choices...and beleiefs...that lead you there ....
everybody needs a guiding light ....
to some people its religion ..
but as you were saying ....should we be open ...to always comparing religions to each other?why do we have the religion we have ?
well here comes the ..culture ...country ..nationality ..family .etc..factors. these factors control what you beleive in ....and if you wanna escape them ...and change them ...then you are escaping your identity ...cause they are apart of who you are ....and they r the reason why you beleive....
Im a muslim....but a very realistic anti-extremist ...
I think ...whatever religion or beleif ...anyone has ..
they will find ..their path...and they will be guided ...
and will reach the knowledge they seek...as long as they dont just read it out of a book.....but feelit ...experience it ...learn it ...sense it ....and truely belive in it
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Marco
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ok
October 17, 2005 - 05:28 AM
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im convinced somehow. if you being religious means, what you explain here, i see no problem at all. i can just hope that theres a lot of muslims in this world as critical and reflecting like you. somehow, it really gives me some hope it may be so ...
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Feyikemi
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Re: EQUITY! Humans have to believe!
October 19, 2005 - 06:32 AM
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I took a stab at atheism when I was younger because I couldn't understand certain things about my religion. It was short-lived and I actually felt that being an atheist doesn't mean one is anti-religion or anti-Christ for that matter. I just didn't last long as an atheist because I felt like I was floating and without direction. It is true that some religions can be so restricting and far-reaching at the same time because as rational beings, our minds can be streched out as far as we desire but we can only know so much. The beautiful thing about believing though, is that you know there is much more out there that one can understand but the knowledge that is out there will not determine who has less or who has more. Quite simply, every person believes in something, may that person be an atheist, Catholic, Buddhist, or Muslim. I believe that we are on the same journey but we travel different paths and we'll meet at some point.
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Saladin
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Re: EQUITY! Humans have to believe!
October 20, 2005 - 05:06 AM
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Originally posted by Fuchs
I would also say, that it's not really a proper way to think that somebody (the president, the priester, Bob Marley, Jesus, Mohammed, Buddha ... or Oneself) have found the eternal truth, because it means, one is not open to new ideas that way. So we have to believe to decide for the moment, but we have to criticise to know more the next time...
Look Fuchs,
Allah says to the Muslims in the Qur'an: "And thus We have made you a medium (just) nation" (2:143)
This means that Islam accepts values and ethics of
other faiths and nations, even if sometimes they go in
opposition with its fundamentals.
Moreover, Muhammad (s) says: "Wisodm is the aim of the believer, wherever he finds it".
This particular quote Muahammad (S) said it to a
Persian man (Salman Al-Farisiyy) who came to Medina to
embrace Islam, when the latter expressed
his admiring of the wisdom of the Persian king "Anas
Anushervan".
He says also: "The best of you in Jahiliyya (before Islam had started), is the best of you in Islam".
Meaning that good deeds that existed even in the corrupt Jahiliyya -where people buried their newborn girls alive, and when attacking commerical caravans of other tribes was an "honor"-,are accepted by Islam.
What -I believe- or what I think, is that one carries the moral responsibility to choose an adequate path that guides him/her during lifetime.
I found that Islam presents itself as a continuum of Judaism and Christendom...a continuum of the same message of Jesus, Moses, Aaron, Abraham, Isaac, Ishmael, Jacob, Joseph, John, Jonah, Solomon, David, Noah and all of those apostles.
I found also that Islam unifies the origin of all human beings, as being God's creation, and as being descendants of Eve and Adam.
I knew that Islam, though having fundamentals, it is a system that is capable of adapting itself to time and space variables, while keeping its basics.
I put aside how much much are most of today's Muslims deviated from the fundamental basics of Islam, and I really found my "peace of mind" in those basics.
Summing up, I see Islam a the only truth in my own life, as an overall life system regulating work, family, behavior, ethics, spirituality, sports, art, science, even state affairs, and human brotherhood.
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Marco
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EQUITY! Humans have to believe!
October 20, 2005 - 06:24 AM
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so now i should explain, whats my guiding light. to show up a bit how much peace i have in my soul? ok.
when i was 18 y. my life seemed to be at its end in my eyes. theres was no reason to live for, even though i had no material problems at all (born in berlin, finished secondary school, chances enough). my problem was that this world didnt make any sense in my eyes. how can people treat each other like this? how can there be so much wealth and so much sufferation the same time? where are the hearts of the people? where are their minds?
today im somehow a bit advanced in CRITICAL THEORY OF SOCIETY / CRITICAL SCIENCE and i found ways and friends to do something about the situation. i have an idea WHY the world is like this and i share them with others. and together we are searching for more answer and ways to make this world a better one for everybody. THIS IS WHAT KEEPS ME ALIVE. during this time i also learned to enjoy live, because i realised that it doesnt help anybody to be in a bad mood a physical condition.
one thing at last: i dont care if someone call himself a mulsim or an atheist... i care about this: FOR ME THERE IS NO PEACE WITH OPPRESSION AND EXPLOITATION. that kind of peace ill fight to my very end! peace! fuchs
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