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anpsmn
Joined: Mar 22, 2005
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Marriages are made in heaven!
April 20, 2005 - 06:29 AM
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People do say that marriages are made in heaven,but why are there always a problem in maintaining a relationship.
Most of the times the men are the ones who complains. Is it b'coz of the commitments , restrictions....or what?
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Dr.Muhammad Mukhtar Alam
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Marriage need to be strengthened with prayer 5 times a day
April 20, 2005 - 11:55 AM
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Marriage are made here on this Earth with the grace of Almighty. Men and women need to forgive each other and then adhere to the commands for prayer, fidelity, tithes for a successful marriage. It is the spiritual quotient that makes the marriage sustainable and not the material considerations.
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C. Gudz
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Re: Marriages are made in heaven!
April 22, 2005 - 04:28 AM
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How many marriages do you know that are like paradise?
Marriages are institutionalized in societies who tend to see monogamous long-term relationships as the best way to show commitment and love. Marriage is a social construct and has taken many forms since the beginning of humankind. Marriage is not instinctual nor is it for everyone. Marriages fail because people are fallible.
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redmamba
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by necessity, we are so ordered!
April 23, 2005 - 09:15 AM
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why marry? - for companionship, for celebrating self and above all for creation.
And marriage is so necesary because our nature demands that kind of arrangement,construct or order.
Dogs, cats, lions, birds and other organisms have their way. they live in colonies or herds or groups for the purposes of survival. the copulate instictually for the purposes of continuity of the species.
Human beings unlike all other animals are self-conscious. their self-consciousnes enables them hold themselves as object of knowledge and to move themselves towards given goals-mentally so to speak.
The ability of human beings to reason and self consiousness necesitates that his or her instincts be channelled into an order that suites the environment.
The ordering of the instinct for survival, the instinct for continuity and the instinct of emptyness or that vacuum in us that makes us eke for relationship is what has brought about the different forms of marriage.
So marriage, i would define it, is a rational channelling of our instinct for fulfillment or nurture and the instinct that calls us to be pro-creators.
Given it involves rational channelling, it means that alot of mind work has to be put into the equation for us to have a successful marriage. By nature we are ordered that we desire a union with the other. by reason we quide our desire and direct it in the way we deem best. Wrong thinking, therefore, would mean a broken marriage. I think if people can think properly and try to understand each other, they can have a wonderful marriage. There are those, although the instincts and urges remain in place, they rationally channel their energies towards other interests. they suppress or repress or sublimate because they think the other interests are better than a life in marriage.
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blue thinker
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Re: Marriages are made in heaven!
April 25, 2005 - 04:18 AM
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Sorry, but I disagree on some points you made, Gideonwafula. On what premise is your statement that animals aren't self conscious, based? If you look at most mammals, there is a behavioural tendency towards a structure in their "society". I have not been inside the mind of an elephant or gorilla, so it is difficult for me to say whether they are conscious or not. I am against the whole notion therefore, that humans are in some way 'better' or 'different' to animals. All we have is our apparent intelligence and complex language and dress. But even there the argument is flawed. Certain birds, for example have an extremely complex languange which zoologists have not totally been able to decipher, despite their intelligence. Even as far as intelligence goes, there are different types of intelligence. Monkeys for example have a far greater developed kinesthetic intelligence compared to humans.
The point I'm trying to make is that we should not see ourselves as superior to the creatures we share our planet with.
I would say that marriage is something that is definitely a social construct, as cgudz says. It isn't a necessity for a healthy monogamous relationship, but merely a formality which certain cultures delegate importance to. I'd like to get married, but only because its nice to have a celebration of some description, which my family can participate in. After that there are legal benefits of getting married rather than living with someone for life, but that's simply a product of the legal system, which is a product of history and society.
What is far more important than a marriage is the partnership that a couple shares. Here, love is the key to holding all aspects of a relationship together. Its saddening how many loveless marriages there are in the world. Over to you.
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redmamba
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Oh! animals and autoconscience!
April 26, 2005 - 07:52 AM
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Bluethinker, maybe i am wrong to sweep and say that only human beings are auto-conscious. but i think i am most likely on the right.
I will not claim that Human beings are of more importance than other beings but i will still mantain that Human beings exude supremacy in the hierachical structure of beings.
there is a difference between acting by instinct, from instinct, with instinct and acting consciously.
Human beings at times act, just as animals do, on instinct. they receive stimulus and they jump into action in responce.
But people have a special ability, that of capturing themselves in their own actions- and that is auto-conscience. so, according to all that i have observed all around me and read, i would agree that other animals have a certain degree of consciousness but no auto-conscience.
it is lack of this ability that gives them their characteristic lack of planing before hand, not storing and not developing. Man has shown his superiority in the way he tames and innovates. and we should acknoledge human superiority if we are to call on them, that they care for the other animals and the ecosystem which sustains them.
----as we discuss marriage, we have to acknowledge its necesity for us to work and cultivate proper human families.
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Luke Lieberman
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Re: Marriages are made in heaven!
April 27, 2005 - 10:16 AM
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cgudz - I think society sees marriages less as the best way to "express love" - and more as the most stable way to raise children.
I think it is certainly that - a stable marraige is the best environment for children to be raised in.
as for them being "Made in heaven" - is this really a question about whether or not there are some butt necked angles flying around in the clouds are deciding who should get together.
No marraiges are made by people down here on earth - and they are sometimes unmade by those same people.
That said monogomy seems to be a deeply ingrained instinct as there have been pair bonding for hundreds of thousands of years.
We are the ONLY primate we does this, Monkeys, apes etc basically the big male gets all the females he wants and the rest have to fend for themselves.
But in human society it is different
I have heard the theory forwarded that when Man developed tools and became a hunter - he necissarily became a pack hunter.
In order to be a pack hunter - in order for the social unit of a "Pack" or "Tribe" to form the dominant male had to stop hogging all the females - pair bonding ensued.
This was accompanied by physiological changes on the female which I could go into but better to just suggest that people read "The Naked Ape" by Desmond Morris.
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C. Gudz
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Re: Marriages are made in heaven!
May 10, 2005 - 03:05 AM
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"I think society sees marriages less as the best way to "express love" - and more as the most stable way to raise children.
I think it is certainly that - a stable marraige is the best environment for children to be raised in."
Luke - That's cool if you think that and as you know, many people would agree with you. I however, think that any 'stable' committed parent either single, dating or coupled should be included in our notion of qualified parent. You don't just need to be married to raise a child well. Single parents are quite capable of raising children without a partner. Common-law couples are quite capable of raising a child well. And since you live in the U.S., you are probably quite aware of same-sex couples who go through a lot of processes and paper work to become parents. This commitment to parenting is more than most people go through. And yet same-sex relationships in the U.S. are not legitimized by marriage. Are they not 'stable' to you?
Marriage is clearly the societal norm, it is instiutionalized, encouraged, rewarded, it is completely dominant. I'm surprised that you would not value other forms of family structure as a good child-rearing environment. But maybe you just didn't elaborate fully how you felt.
I'd be interested in hearing more, and how other people feel about parenting. Just because marriage is the norm, does it mean that it is the best?
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Anu Jaanu
Joined: May 3, 2005
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Re: Marriages are made in heaven!
May 15, 2005 - 11:41 AM
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For people who strongly believe in God, it is convenient to think that marriages are made in heaven. If something goes wrong, they can easily put the blame on God and be like "well that's how God intended it to be". But what about the rest of the gang (the "free thinkers" or Satanists)? Where would their marriages be made? :P
As for people having problems sustaining marriages, it has a lot to do with power struggles. Obviously, a great deal of compromises have to be made in order to achieve a common goal by both partners. And people are just too headstrong on doing that. Feminazies [not feminists!], tend to take power up another notch where they preach about how it's okay to want more money, more power, and that if a guy isn't fulfilling ALL your needs, he isn't worth your time, etc. Sooner or later, the guy's going to give in realizing that no matter what he's been doing, it's never enough or never good enough! That leads straight to a disastrous divorce (possibly with an affair thrown in somewhere.)
I'm not saying that women are responsible for failed marriages, guys contribute to it as well in their own ways. (Someone can shed some light on that!), but that seems to be the trend in the West where most of the time, it's the women who're filing divorces as they tend to take a LOT [materialistically] out of the divorce settlement. The guys rarely get an equal share out of it.
- mX
P.S. - What is the origin of marriage?
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Awais Aftab
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Re: Marriages are made in heaven!
June 5, 2005 - 08:08 AM
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I don't think that marriages are made in heaven, or atleast, not ALL of them are made in heaven. As is obvious, "made is heaven" refers to "decided by God". Those people who believe that everything is decided would believe that they are made in heaven. I disagree with it because it rules out human free will, which is the basis of all our evaluation of actions. However, i have witnessed several astonishing events when a couple was miraculously formed as if it had been decided. So, to keep on the safe side, i'll say that some marriages may be decided by God but not all of them.
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