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caroline muntemba
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can anything ever justify war
March 9, 2005 - 12:09 PM
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can anything ever justify war? can anything reasonably justify the loss of hundreds, thousaands, millions lives, can anything ever justify the heartaches of the coountless people that have lost there families, friends, loved ones.
can anything ever justify the loss of so many young lives- children meant to be future presidents,leaders,peace promoters, or the many dreams that die with them.
can anything ever comfort the children that go to sleep with sounds of gun shot or bombs going off in the not so far distance, or those that wake up to the terrifying sounds of war,
can anything ever erase from the young memories of the children that survive- the horrifying sight of ddead bodies , so much blood, so many shattered buildings that once were their homes or the homes of their friends/family.
can anything ever justify the pain- physical,emotional even spiritual,
can anything ever rebuild the faith in humanity or in beliefs/religion- after seeing people kill each other or after having prayed(whatever religion) that it never comes to war- only to wake to one.
what about the child that goes to bed praying for protection of his family and wakes up to find them all dead-what will heal the pain that child feels.
REALLY CAN ANYTHING JUSTIFY WAR?
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Gerald Derome
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Re: can anything ever justify war
March 9, 2005 - 09:57 AM
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NO
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Chris W
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Re: can anything ever justify war
March 10, 2005 - 02:10 AM
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I believe the Jews of Nazi Germany would beg to differ with you. Though a person on the individual level in his right mind when faced with the ultimate reality of loss of their life and limbs would then make the rational decision to avoid a conflict. The only way to deter the popular instruments to enact policy is to destroy the image of the individual who fights the war. The glorification of soldiers and the romanticism involved in war needs to be diffused and replaced with the actual facts of a war, which leaves the individuals who participate with both physical and emotional wounds. Kill the pride and vanity associated with soldiery, and you will end wars, only when this happens will wars slow. The idealization that society places upon soldiers, which is the reason individuals enlist, is because of humans biggest need, the need to belong, to be something. I would encourage you to point anyone looking to enlist to a veterans hospital where the reality of war and its consequences can be made evident to the individual before they go of in search of fulfillment that they think soldiery will provide for them.
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Luke Lieberman
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Re: can anything ever justify war
March 10, 2005 - 02:41 AM
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I agree with my friends above the unfortunate reality is that sometimes war is unavoidable for the simple reason than an malevolant force is attacking you -
when the Nazis were marching across Europe - you had 2 choices - subjugate yourselves to the Nazis - or stand and fight.
Germany was trying to destroy England - what were the English supposed to do - tell the Nazis that they do not beleive in war?
Were the Americans wrong for storming Normandy and freeing the French from Nazi occupation - or liberating the death camps?
I don't think so.
I think war should be avioded at all costs - but there are times it is just necissary -
After 9/11 I had absolutely no problem with going into Afghanistan and knocking out the Al Qaeda headquaters - you cannot let something like that go unanswered.
the war in Iraq I was far more conflicted about - (and still am, although I hope democracy wins the day).
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Bravo Bravo
Joined: Mar 13, 2005
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Re: can anything ever justify war
March 13, 2005 - 11:35 AM
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Yes,
Peace is the one thing that justifies war. To achieve peace there must be something as powerful as war and to have war there must be something as wonderful to fight for such as peace.
- bravo
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Michael Newton-McLaughlin
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Re: can anything ever justify war
March 14, 2005 - 05:51 AM
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Luke-
why do you (and many others i suppose certainly) continually use only US examples of war when responding to posts and question abot justifications for violence?
What about South African dutch populations who were fighting against a ruling British elite for their own racial autonomy in the early 1900s, (The Boer war), who lost but subsequently gained autonony, took over for the British as the rulling elite who subdued and controlled the native populations and created a system of apartheid - did the South African national congress and its military wings have every right to try to break down this oppressive power? Were the South Africans justified in doing this?
What about the case of a 1952 CIA backed coup d'etat in Iran that took the powerful Shah from his honeymoon exile in Europe and replaced him in power over Iran, where he promised not to nationalize the oil industry and kept a tight military control over the people with the nod of Washington, Paris and London - and as a result millions turned to a peculiarly different form of islamic nationalism not quite seen before, and having themselves a violent revolution in 1979 to remove the fascist elite and nationalise the country's principle economic revenue in order to maintain some autonomy over it (most of it is and was still controlled by OPEC (saudis). Is that ok for war to happen?
What if I tell you the Vietnamese had every right in defending themslves against the French, who colonized them and split the country into three regions (Tonkin, Annam, Cochinchina), helped established a powerfull and oppressive rulling class in these areas, and then when they were defeated the Americans tried to prop up this oppressive rulling class, in the South, so the Vietnamese fought to reunify their people - would that be a good justification for war?
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James Dagger
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Just a few thoughts on a tangent
March 25, 2005 - 05:26 AM
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War can be justified. Self defence is a justification for war, and funny enough its stated in United Nations Charters, treaties and conventions that sovereign nation states may mobilise in matters when their national sovereignty is threatened
The problem with this is what a nation state determines as a "threat". Now you can say that communist pouring through North Korea, Vietnam and South Pacific asia is a threat that must be fought by forward defence. (As done in The Korean war & the Vietnam war) and mobilise your army to face this threat. Hell its even done today with the actions against Iraq and Afganistan, although communist has been replaced with terrorist. The other problem with this concept is the idea of claiming a threat that never existed, this allows nation states to react in self defence and allows them to print material (propaganda) so the public believes in the justification of the act. This has been done in world war 1, world war 2, and is even continuing today in the war on terror and operation Iraq freedom.
Now, one thing that no one has really mentioned here is the alternatives to open warfare. Now, i'm not talking about diplomacy, because in reality there is absolutly no need to sit around the peace table when you have the Bigger guns, the close friends and wide public support home and abroad. I'm talking about the more sinister of actions, stealth, Reconnaissance and good ole fashion spys. Now you have to remember that EVERYBODY does it, which makes it ok  (well not really but you know) and that this sort of "combat" can be FAR more effective in starting, waging and ending war.
You really think that there was no action over the demilitarised zone in north korea because the boys up there thought it wouldn't be a good year to attack? maybe. But a better explaination is that the bigger guys are watching you and if you do something out of line then make sure you look over your shoulder twice where ever you go.
Now i dont mean to frigthen you or annoy you to the point of flooding my inbox with distastiful emails. But I really dont think the war on terror is gonna be won by taking majour cities and searching for terrorists.Its gonna be won by the waiter with a silencer
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Martin Tairo M.
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No, Nothing
March 30, 2005 - 03:39 AM
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If you kill someone, there is no justification. War causes death and suffering not to mention destruction of property and livelihood. For a civilized world, i think we should leave war to the animals in zoos and forests. We should use reasonable measures to solve conflicts that do affect us. War??? Not the solution.
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