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Vandana
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kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
January 8, 2005 - 07:56 AM
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I wish to discuss kashmir issue with you guys. It is important. Why? I will tell you cause there are people who are interfering and living a brain washed life and fighting for jehad. I think there life is being wasted and put on edge. I pity militants and military people of that area. I have been told that they critisize anyone they listen about. Have they been brain washed so badly or they are fighting for just a piece of land which in their in this life will never be theirs and only god know if they live their full life will they be able to see their kids with that piece of land. I just wonder. Are militants of any particular religion cause i do not think they get time to worship. I feel this kashmir is my mother land i do not wish to share it with anyone. And these political leader wether they ar of India or foriegn elements have no right on that beauty. I wonder when will they realize this fact that it is a beauty which can never be unearthed. It is not business but something to be worshipped. The boundary of India remains the same no matter what. I guess people who entered here has got the citizen ship of this beautiful land of India. And those should be taken care of who have taken this opportunity of express themselves after all it is our baby and we the people of India have spent limitless amount of money on it and cherished it no matter what. I do not wish to see any more fights in this region cause the nature is worth enjoying. Do you? Please discuss.
Thank you
Vandana
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nlsmlla
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Pallavi
January 8, 2005 - 08:44 AM
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salam.
i dont know much about people living in Kashmir
but have heared that people off Kashmir donot want
war , they do not want to be with pakistan like other
muslims of india,
the people that fight are trained terrorists of
pakistan do u think that whatever have i heard is
true?
can u peaze give some information
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Vandana
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reply
January 9, 2005 - 03:11 AM
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I do not think any one country can be blamed. It is all political. As for humans are concerned bundaries are drawn for every one to create fear for good living and livelihood of other human and living beings. As far as pakistan is concerned if they are doing such things it may be at the order of one authorised person only and frankly only a fool works on the command of one person.
Anyway the issue is not what people are doing and were they are trained. But i am thinking of all those trained people who are wasting their time for such nuisance meaning what i do not understand is why are theywasting time on winning something in the boudary line which they already have and can enjoy. If they work such trained thicks out in their life's for employment and earn whatever way they may be but seemingly decent enough they will definitely have what they want. Why cant they get it through their heads -one thing for sure that boundaries line are sucess and failures of experiences and achievements of authorised signatory - a politicians which is only one in number in their profile as on their jobs, their earnings for their lives and family.I guess they are wasting their time fighting for something they already posses.It is just their thinking that they are fighting for something which they are suppose to win like Alexander, but they forget this is the age of matrix and not stone lighting competition which they cannot get. Their thinking needs t be changed for positive attitude by making them feel important for their life's as well as that of others. What do you think?
Vandana
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Vivek
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Re: kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
January 9, 2005 - 07:06 AM
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I think the problem we as Indians face in Kashmir is a classic example for our disinterest in anything to do with proper governance of our country. I agree that as it stands today... everything is politically motivated... and a horrible mess. Nobody is even sure as to what exactly happened as both sides have a story to tell... and none of us are interested in ratifying each others' claim.
As things stand today... foreign mercenaries who kill for a living outnumber kashmiris among the militants fighting Indian forces in Kashmir. And Pakistan definitely has a role in this! And is not about religion.... it never was! India, as a nation offers more religious freedom to its muslim citizens, than the militants who claim to be fighting a "jihad" against us.
We had a chance to end this matter in 1947 itself... when Kashmir was acceeded to the Indian Union... we should called for a ceasefire only after we had driven out all of the Pakistani invaders. But for some reason... our leaders then deferred from the decision... and we are still paying the price for it.
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vinod
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on Kashmir
January 9, 2005 - 12:42 PM
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The struggle in Kashmir has always been about their political standing... not jehad. From 1947 until the late 80's, Kashmiris attempted to give themselves a representative voice through the process of elections. But violence unfortunately turned out out to be a more IMMEDIATE way of getting the attention they weren't getting from India and Pakistan. And jehad became a scapegoat which has now acquired legitimacy in the minds of some people. It has also caused millions of others to see the issue through a distorted lens.
It is all about how we choose to see the issue... each player sees it from only their angle. It's as if no other perspective could exist... therefore providing a convenient excuse to label the 'other' as 'terrorist' or 'enemy' or whatever. Us vs Them. Each player is choosing a position convenient to them on the historical timeline as their starting point for their involvement in the issue. What else could it tun out to be but a mess? Real and lasting solutions can only come from a change in the way we see our own involvement... and not from doing more of what we have been doing in Kashmir for years now.
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Asma
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kashmir problem
January 27, 2005 - 05:22 AM
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kashmir problem is there since last 58 years. it got momentum since last 16 years when people of kashmir got into the arm struggle. Way back on April 1948 UN passed an declaration in which they said that people of kashmir have right to decide about their future but still this date this declaration was never put into the practise so people of kashmir feel cheated.therefore they are fighting for their rights and will continue to fight till peace and justice is done.
i think it is very important that who ever is interested in kashmir should knon about the political history of kashmir. secondly if there want to know the facts they should visit the place to know it because media is either biased or present the iceberg of the reality.
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vinod
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Re: kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
January 28, 2005 - 01:47 AM
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I agree with Asma whe she says that people must visit Kashmir before forming a strong one-sided opinion on the issue. I myself have done that twice and have literally found the visits an eye opener. It challenges everything we hold dear as Indians. But one has to go with an open mind and not with the intent to defend the official 'Indian' position. In any conflict situation, people want to be 'heard' and not just 'listened' to.
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szaman
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kashmir issue
January 28, 2005 - 07:31 AM
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friends:
I'm shamim from Bangladesh..........quite pissed of with teh politicians in my country............I'll get back to detail discussion on kashmir with u sometimes later.........but i wanna tell u that I beleive th epolicians both in India and pakistan lack the real willingness to solve teh Kashmir issue or such related/unrelated ZIHAD issue coz they wanna make these political issue to be in power.............
and what would Amercan(?) do if Indian adn pakistani politicians solve it themselves.........where would Maerica show its importance and power.........
so .........
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Kiran
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On Kasmir
February 22, 2005 - 02:18 AM
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In my view, the present situation for Kashmir is a political issue, and if anyone is responsible for the fate of all the kashmiri's, its the Political parties in Both India and Pakistan.
The voice of Kashmiri People heard today is different from what was heard earlier. Today, they long for peace, and away from the problems that are posed by the armies of both the nations causing the problem. I feel that they are justfied in their demands, after undegoing the whole turmoil and loing families to the war.
I had never been to Kashmir, nor I had been to Pakistan. I used to be under a perception as a child that people out of Indian borders are Bad, and like wise, many on that side of the borders might have thought. But then, I learnt later, through readings and interactions with numerous people, that its not people who are bad, its the face that we were shown by the governments and media.
Well, finally, I realised that its the Politicians who are the culprits. Pallavi, I am saying all this, becuase, your question is an intresting one and if any one can find a solution to the problem for Kashmir, its not UN nor other Countries, not even the Indian Government. Its the residents of Kashmir who have to find a solution for themselves, demand their rights and get rid of the problems.
Politicians of all nations play the game of power to suit their needs. Trusting them for something is of no use. And discussing the problem doesnt solve the problem, as Vinod was saying, Kashmiri's should be heard , not listened to. People should rise to support them and help them in their cause, people across the borders.
I heard another intresting fact about Kashmir from a friend. He was explaining the history of all the turmoil and then told me that it all started because of the value and quality of the spices grown there. Kashmir is the land of Paradise, the land of Valleys where high quality Spices were grown. The revenue earned by exporting the spices to other nations is very high that the then ruling East India Company developed the area to suit its needs. And the current situation is because both the nations want to have the revenue for them selves. This is what I heard.
If that is true, then, unfortunately, the revenue is not there now because of the situation and the people there are suffering, in the name of different issues.
There are lot of happenings from 1942 Quit India Movement, which when we consider, leaving our Bias for the so called leaders, would reveal many intresting things about them. And the current situations in India, Pakistan and even Bangladesh are the results of the incidents that took place during that time and the further developments. And we, as their descendants are forced to bear these politicians many of whom dont have any respect for anything except power and money
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vinod
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Re: kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
March 6, 2005 - 01:25 AM
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Kiran, what you've said about spices bringing in revenue is really interesting. It certainly puts a new spin on the issue and potential revenue earning capaciy may well be the reason why both countries are willing to expend so much on maintaining the status quo in Kashmir.
Hopefully, people from India/Pakistan/Kashmir will be able to see through these hidden agendas and will be able to take steps to see each other as human beings first. Labels that exclude people need to be discarded... they only indicate stagnation.
Btw, I would recommend a visit to Kashmir... open minded people like you are likely to be able to provide the Kashmiri youth with the non-threatening space they require to share their concerns and fears. 
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Kiran
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Re: kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
March 7, 2005 - 01:56 AM
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Well, I heard about it from some Defence People and Media People. And now, the problem is that living under constant fear will change the perception of a person. And 50 years of fear changed the thiniking of Kashmiri's.
To make them trust anyone is not an easy task. It requires a lot of effort, and its here that the Governments should not interfere. In relaity, it will never happen, cos, no Government is ready to lose it hold on the region it controls.
If the Governments stop interfering in the efforts made by Individuals, then, we can see some hope.
Thats my feeling.
Like there are two sides to a coin always, every issue is having its two sides. I am now trying to explore the other side
And visit to Kashmir is one that is on my list, but, my profession kills my time. I need to make some time for a visit there.
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vinod
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On trust
March 12, 2005 - 02:03 AM
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Hi Kiran,
Just had a thought about something you've said... actually the words 'make them trust' that you've used in your post. Another way of seeing it would be for Indians and Pakistanis (at least those of us who are open to the idea of peace in Kashmir) to BE trustworthy... that way Kashmiris will have the space to decide for themselves whether they want to trust us or not. We just have to say and do things with the truest possible intent and an inclusive outlook and leave it to others to decide whether we are worthy of their trust. I strongly feel that a genuine attempt on our parts to be open to them will result in at least some of them opening up to us slowly. Even the slightest hint of compulsion, even for a worthy cause, may lead Kashmiris to feel that there are some hidden agendas behind our words.
This is what I've felt from my visits there.
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Luke Lieberman
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Re: kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
March 12, 2005 - 04:01 AM
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I really know nothing of the conflict -
how did it begin and how is it going?
forget about whose fault it is, what is needed to satosfy the factions?
why can't India and Pakistan draw a line through the terrirotry and share it?
Does Kashmir want independance?
It seems like the forces in Kashmir are too confused in conflict for any side to win a descisive victory.
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Sarah
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Re: kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
March 18, 2005 - 08:04 AM
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Relating the Kashmir issue I would just like to state that we should emphasize more on what the Kashmiris want today rather than fighting among ourselves that Kashmir belongs to either India or Pakistan. We have spent decades fighting over Kashmir to no avail are we fighting for a peice of land or are we really fighting to safe guard the interests and rights of the people of Kashmir? it is high time that the Kashmiris are given their due rights.
There should be a plabacite held in Kashmir providing a chance for the Kashmiris to decide for their own future. I have had a chance of interacting with some Kashmiris from Srinagar and I was surprised to find out that they are never in favor of being part of either India or Pakistan.
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Udara
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Re: kashmir issue - I invite you to discuss this?
March 18, 2005 - 08:17 AM
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I think when we say that the Kashmiris should decide the future, it should be original kashmiris will it be Hindu or will it be Muslims.
But right now, I do not think there will be any solutions. I dont think it will be practical to have a state of Kashmir as it will either unite with India or Pakistan.
I think the best right now would be to use the LOC as a border atleast to some extent!
Udara
PS:- Luke, Kashmir issue is a long issue and you need to check out few sites. But make sure you visit BOTH pakistan and indian sites on this!
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